--- Log opened Sun Mar 30 00:00:52 2003
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00:30 < armijn> re
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00:42 < A-Tui> hi all
00:51 < o1k> hi A-Tui all_OK?
00:53 < A-Tui> hi olk
00:53 < A-Tui> yes all right!
00:53 < A-Tui> i was reading and posting some news
01:00 < o1k> nice to hear ! I was just watching tele ...
01:01 < o1k> Its just some silly abrev form obiwan kanobi ...
01:02 < o1k> I should go to sleep .... I've had a nice bottle of beaujelais.
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01:03 < A-Tui> re
01:03 < o1k> re
01:03 < A-Tui> power link unplugged
01:03 < A-Tui> :)
01:05 < o1k> hmm thats nice ;-) I only get disconected when I am over an ssh link with my isp.
01:05 < A-Tui> ops thats worse :)
01:06 < o1k> Yehh I know but still running irssi form my home. Thats stable no disconnects untill  @home goes down.
01:08 < A-Tui> irssi survived? :)
01:12 < o1k> It hasnt been down. But still I must go to sleep .... wine_influence >
01:12 < A-Tui> :)
01:12 < A-Tui> good night, and happy dreams!
01:13 < o1k> thanks think I'll need some asperine tomorrow... Good night to you 2 A-Tui... Bye
01:13 < A-Tui> bye
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04:01 -!- Topic for #rocklinux: CVS_RSH=ssh cvs -d anoncvs@anoncvs.rocklinux.de:/cvs co -P rock-1.5 && cvs -d :pserver:anonymous@clifford.homedns.org:/home/cvs co -P rock-src-1.7
04:01 -!- Topic set by ChanServ [Thu Nov 21 19:29:37 2002]
04:01 (Users #rocklinux)
04:01 [ A-Tui   ] [ esden   ] [ kasc      ] [ owl     ] [ rolla ] [ tfing] 
04:01 [ aszlig  ] [ hannes__] [ netrunner_] [ Parabull] [ ruddur] 
04:01 [ capchaos] [ huebi   ] [ o1k       ] [ ringo78_] [ SMP   ] 
04:01 -!- Irssi: #rocklinux: Total of 16 nicks [0 ops, 0 halfops, 0 voices, 16 normal]
04:01 -!- Channel #rocklinux created Tue Jun 11 09:27:41 2002
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07:53 < rxr> re
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09:07 < wosch> moin
09:34 -!- blindcoder [blindcoder@pD9E4FD7B.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #rocklinux
10:03 < kasc> moin
10:05 < blindcoder> moin kasc
10:09 < rxr> rehi kasc blindcoder
10:09 < rxr> hi wosch
10:09 < wosch> hi, installing alpha... runs nice so far
10:11 < blindcoder> moin rxr wosch
10:12 < rxr> wosch: in wich step of the install are you now ?
10:12 * rxr currently also testing in vmware
10:17 * blindcoder documenting (finally) his LED - case-mod and ledmeter Software
10:23 < rxr> ;-)
10:23 < rxr> I also had a ledmeter software for an 8 LED connected to parallel port hack ;-)
10:26 < blindcoder> yes, exactly that is what I have. I'm now finally going to write some documentation and put the ledmeter program online so it's "backed up" somewhere :)
10:27 < blindcoder> actually I have 2x6 LEDs, 8 of them on parallel port, 3 on NIC and one on IDE-Activity :)
10:28 < wosch> It's through with all copying. I did not watch all of it, though.
10:29 < wosch> There's a minor glitch in the beginning, when you first mount filesystems
10:30 < rxr> the mount point is not specified, or what is the minor glicht ?
10:30 < rxr> er glitch ;-)
10:30 < wosch> after mounting, the mount point is not displayed in the dialog
10:30 < rxr> jups I also noticied this
10:31 < wosch> ok
10:53 < wosch> btw, is it possible to fine-tune a locale setting so it uses english as a language but localized settings for date or currency formats and such?
10:53 < wosch> blinkenlights... :)
10:54 < blindcoder> `TZ="GMT" date` ?
10:55 < rxr> I'll announce the alpha ISO now - any objections ?
10:55 < wosch> not yet, it doesn't explode your machine...
10:55 < rxr> hm?
10:56 < wosch> no ugly bugs found so far.
10:59 < rxr> Good.
11:00 < wosch> Umh, is there something different than vi available in the initial stage? (No flames please!)
11:07 < blindcoder> http://www.crash-override.net/ledmeter/ <-- not pretty, but it does the job :)
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11:49 -!- _wosch_ is now known as wosch
11:50 < wosch> rxr: I like your alpha! No major hassles. great!
11:51 < wosch> It's great to see a KDE without all that suse crap
12:01 < wosch> umh... running depmod -a still scrolls lots of unresolved symbols
12:02 < wosch> trying to modprobe snd-sb16 also gives unresolved symbols, including commos like kfree, printk, ...   weird!
12:08 < rxr> hm
12:08 < rxr> Normally this should have been fixed
12:08 < rxr> this was caused by a missing genksyms
12:09 < rxr> maybe this happend because this was not one build - I did several updated rebuilds in the same tree.
12:10 < rxr> I'll verify if this bug is still present in the CVS, or if this is only a build problem
12:10 < rxr> btw I scheduled a freshmeat announcement for this ISO.
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12:12 < rockwosch> :)
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12:22 < wosch> I'm no expert on alsa. weird... even though it failed to modprobe snd-sb16, i suddenly have sound in kde
12:26 < o1k> It only uses soundcore rest are alsa modules.
12:28 < wosch> what do i have to install in order to get mozilla running? it complains about a missing libstdc++-libc6.1-1.so.2
12:28 < rxr> gcc3 needs to be installed
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12:30 < rxr> cu later
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13:53 < ringo78_> how do I get my ide writer to work ? I have got ide-scsi compiled, how do I get devfs to create the device ?
14:27 -!- daja77 [~daja77@dialin-145-254-073-009.arcor-ip.net] has joined #rocklinux
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14:49 < ringo78_> stupid had to compile cd support for scsi .... Mjam I am (...) fill in the blanks....
14:52 -!- Mike1 [~mike@odin.informatica.co.cr] has joined #rocklinux
14:53 < ringo78_> hi Mike1
15:27 < esden> good day everyone
15:27 < daja77> hi esden
15:27 -!- praenti [~praenti@p50802FA7.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #rocklinux
15:27 < praenti> hi
15:27 < esden> huhu praenti 
15:27 * daja77 is fighting the burocrats
15:27 < daja77> hi praenti
15:27 < praenti> Mike1: here?
15:30 < daja77> hmm Mike1 seems to sleep, cr is not switching to dst
15:31 < esden> hmm ... the clock on apollo seems to be wrong ... :-/
15:31 < esden> ahh no ... it is right
15:31 < esden> good
15:32 < praenti> i have a problem here with compiling gnucash. configure says that lib ghttp is unknown but libghttp is installed ...
15:32 < praenti> and i want to fix this damn thing
15:32 < praenti> esden: are you in IN or M?
15:33 < daja77> can you print the error message?
15:33 < praenti> checking for gtkhtml < 1.1... checking for gtk_html_new in -lgtkhtml... yes
15:33 < praenti> Unknown library `ghttp'
15:33 < praenti> Unknown library `ghttp'
15:33 < praenti> checking for ghttp_request_new in -lghttp... no
15:33 < praenti> configure: error: Cannot find ghttp. See the README and config.log for more info.
15:33 < praenti> and a ls in /opt/gnome2/lib:
15:34 < praenti> libghttp.a                                libgtkhtml-2.a                     pango
15:34 < praenti> libghttp.la                               libgtkhtml-2.la                    pkgconfig
15:34 < praenti> libghttp.so                               libgtkhtml-2.so                    python2.2
15:34 < praenti> libghttp.so.1                             libgtkhtml-2.so.0                  vfs
15:34 < praenti> libghttp.so.1.0.0
15:34 < daja77> export LD_LIBRARY_PATH=/opt/gnome2/lib perhaps?
15:35 < praenti> this is done by the conf file already. hmm one moment i have an idea
15:35 < praenti> ok have it. miguel has a typo
15:36 < praenti> ;-)
15:36 < daja77> :)
15:36 < praenti> ahh shit. its no typo
15:36 < praenti> . $base/package/*/*/gnome-2.conf
15:36 < praenti> is right
15:37 < praenti> the - is new
15:37 < praenti> ;-)
15:38 < praenti> ok. as i can see there is no LD_LIBRARY_PATH exported. i will try your idea
15:38 -!- ^wolf^ [~chatzilla@pD9514975.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #rocklinux
15:39 < ^wolf^> wenn ich ./scripts/Download -required ausfuehre, passiert garnichts
15:39 < daja77> ??
15:40 < praenti> ^wolf^: hast du vorher ./scripts/Config ausgeführt?
15:40 < ^wolf^> praenti: ja
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15:40 < praenti> dann is da was faul
15:40 < ^wolf^> praenti: wie kann ich das ergebnis von Config ueberpruefen?
15:41 < esden> praenti: I am in IN
15:41 < praenti> ^wolf^: im unterverz. config liegt dann unter default was drin
15:41 < esden> praenti: why ?
15:41 < ^wolf^> is english preferred here? fine with me
15:41 < praenti> esden: do you come to the lugin meeting?
15:42 < esden> praenti, ^wolf^ ... use english please
15:42 < ^wolf^> ok
15:42 < praenti> ^wolf^: yes. cause we have non german speaking developers
15:42 < ^wolf^> config/ contains: config  packages  packages.txt
15:42 < esden> praenti: I do not think so ... but ... when ? where ?
15:43 < praenti> esden: 16:00 CEST at jagdschloß
15:43 < praenti> i know i will be too late
15:43 < esden> k ... will see what I can do
15:46 < praenti> btw. for the not-german speaking people. wolf has a problem to run Download. he has already run Config and on his system nothing is happening when he start Download
15:47 < esden> praenti: proxy ?
15:47 < ^wolf^> i removed rock-src* --- how do i start all over?
15:47 < ^wolf^> i'd like to install 1.7 dRock
15:49 < esden> use cvs to get the sources (see channel topic)
15:50 < ^wolf^> ok
15:51 < esden> and run "./scripts/Download -all" once more
15:51 < ^wolf^> -all ?
15:52 < ^wolf^> why not -required ?
15:52 < esden> or -required ... 
15:52 < ^wolf^> ok
16:02 < ^wolf^> after the cvs download i run ./scripts/Config ? and then ./scripts/Download ?
16:03 < praenti> argl. gnucash has a bug in configure
16:03 < praenti> i can fix now gnucash...
16:09 < praenti> argl. and a mount has damaged my build i hate it
16:09 < daja77> ??
16:10 -!- tfing [~tfing@ASt-Lambert-101-1-3-166.abo.wanadoo.fr] has joined #rocklinux
16:10 < tfing> moin'
16:11 < praenti> daja77: when you disable the option always cleanup src blabla and your build aborts, then you have some mounts to the directories. when you want to cleanup the src.blabla dirs your build env is damaged
16:12 < daja77> yes I think parts of the build system are not that clever :(
16:13 < praenti> ok. i must go now. i hope i dont have to setup the build completly new.
16:13 < praenti> cu
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16:16 < daja77> hi tfing
16:28 < esden> one shoud use scripts/Cleanup ... just because of that ...
16:28 < daja77> esden: you are too late praenti has quit already
16:30 < ^wolf^> tons of errors: ./scripts/Download: line 430: curl: command not found
16:30 < daja77> ^wolf^: you are required to have curl installed
16:32 < ^wolf^> ok
17:03 < esden> i know ... 
17:03 < esden> I only wanted to state that ..
17:04 < daja77> *g*
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18:15 < ^wolf^> how many MBs does rock dRock -required download? 405 MB are already done
18:29 < ringo78_> ^wolf^: I downloaded 1.7 uses about 1.1 gig.
18:30 < ringo78_> But I downloaded -all.
18:31 < esden> ^wolf^: you can list what is missing for download with scripts/Download -list-missing ... it shows what packages are mising for -all download
18:34 < ^wolf^> 4 now i'd be glad to have -required downloads finished to be able to go on :)
18:39 < esden> ^wolf^: what do you whish to compile ? ... I mean which target ?
18:41 < ^wolf^> dROCK
18:43 < esden> aha 
18:43 < kasc> moin
18:43 < esden> hi kasc 
18:44 < ^wolf^> moin kasc
18:45 < kasc> ^wolf^: why not generic?
18:45 < ^wolf^> dunno
18:51 -!- tcr [~tobrit@p50813376.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #rocklinux
18:51 < tcr> moin all
18:54 < kasc> moin tcr
19:10 < ^wolf^> i would prefer to use kde30 instead of kde31 but i don't see 30 in rock 1.7 anymore
19:11 < ^wolf^> any way to make it download and use kde30 instead?
19:12 < tcr> ROCK doesn't support several versions of the same programm simultanously. Maybe this will get implemented at any time, but not in close feature
19:12 < esden> 1.7 is a development branch ... so it uses also development packages ... (so by the way : kde is always development (dies like windows ;-) )
19:12 < ^wolf^> but i prefer kde 3.0 nevertheless
19:13 < ^wolf^> at least it dies with less icons
19:13 < tcr> ^wolf^: Either you edit the appropriate .desc's file by your hand
19:13 < tcr> ^wolf^: or, as there's a CVS server, you look what cvs version is the one you want
19:13 < ^wolf^> cvs sounds more handy to me
19:14 < tcr> But afaik there's no online viewer for it, since it's clifford private CVS...
19:14 < ^wolf^> oh
19:14 < tcr> Though that was once in discussion and he might have set one up
19:16 < tcr> Hmm I think it wouldn't harm to bug that on ML...
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19:17 < ^wolf^> i am not at all familiar with cvs syntax :(
19:19 < ^wolf^> could i download e.g. http://www.rocklinux.org/snapshots/rock-src-1.7-200302011024.tar.bz2 and check the packages file to see if it still has what i want?
19:20 < tcr> Hmm, yea
19:20 < ^wolf^> do i need to run Config to create packages or is it there from the start?
19:21 < kasc> running Config would be somewhat safer ;)
19:21 < ^wolf^> to create the packages file that is
19:21 < ^wolf^> ok
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19:22 < tcr> ^wolf^: But it'd be really good if you could write an email to the mailinglist that you'd wish the possiblity of more version of the same packages; and explain your case... It's because clifford actually doesn't really want several versions, but some of the others (including me ;)) want it..
19:22 < ^wolf^> can non-subscribers post to the list?
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19:23 < ^wolf^> can i symlink my current downloads/ folder to prevent double downloads?
19:23 < ^wolf^> i d/l'ed 500 MB already
19:24 < tcr> ^wolf^:
19:24 < tcr> ups
19:25 < tcr> ^wolf^: Copy the packages/kde directory (or how it's called from the snapshot into your "main" directoy with the rocklinux sources
19:25 < tcr> Then simply continue within the old sources... you might have to run scripts/Puzzle or some other script, dunno really
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19:38 < ^wolf^> all the older ones like http://www.rocklinux.org/snapshots/rock-src-1.7-200212240430.tar.bz2 extract kde31
19:38 < ^wolf^> surprisingly
19:39 < ^wolf^> ah no, they have both
19:39 < ^wolf^> didnt scroll back far enuf :)
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19:53 < rxr> re
19:54 < tcr> ^wolf^: still any question? If yes ask rxr, he's the guy for everything X related
19:54 -!- holyolli [~holyolli@217.14.168.2] has joined #rocklinux
19:55 < holyolli> moin
19:56 < rxr> hi holyolli
19:56 < esden> hi holyolli 
19:56 < rxr> hi esden
19:56 * rxr away ...
19:56 < holyolli> hi rxr
19:56 < holyolli> huhu esden
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19:58 < ^wolf^> can non-subscribers post to the ML? (i dont feel like subscribing another ML)
20:00 < esden> I think they can ...
20:00 < esden> try
20:00 < tcr> ^wolf^: yes...
20:00 < ^wolf^> ok
20:00 < blindcoder> hi all
20:01 < ^wolf^> i am installing rock-src-1.7-200302011024 now, it still has kde-30
20:02 < esden> that is terribly old
20:02 < ^wolf^> not for a debian user
20:02 < ^wolf^> :)
20:02 < esden> terrible ... I would not do it in your place ...
20:02 < esden> simply use something better then kde
20:02 < esden> like fluxbox ... or windowmaker
20:02 < ^wolf^> kmail is my favorite email client which i use in XFce
20:03 < esden> yuk ... mutt is all you need and even more
20:03 < wosch> The last drock 2.0.0 alpha looks promising
20:03 < ^wolf^> okay lets start a mail client war
20:03 < esden> hehe ;-)
20:03 < ^wolf^> i win.
20:03 < ^wolf^> done.
20:03 < wosch> here I anyone say outlook? *giggle*
20:03 * -> esden shakes his head
20:04 < esden> wosch: ^wolf^ said already ... kmail is very close to outlook
20:04 < esden> ;-)
20:04 < wosch> oh, didn't see that
20:04 < daja77> re
20:04 < esden> re daja77 
20:05 < wosch> I use mozilla for mail, but only coz I got used to it and am too lazy to try something else
20:05 < ^wolf^> mozilla mail doesnt support expiring old messages automatically
20:05 < esden> wosch: it is acceptable ... 
20:05 < ^wolf^> which can be rather handy if you have tons of folders
20:05 < ^wolf^> for tons of mailing lists
20:05 < wosch> moz still has some bugs with imap
20:06 < esden> which mail client has not ...
20:06 < ^wolf^> can i unselect gcc2 in pkgsel?
20:06 < esden> mutt is very close to being fully usable with imap
20:06 < ^wolf^> so that only 3* will be used?
20:07 * -> esden does not need imap
20:07 < daja77> esden: I heard the imap setting for mutt is painful and slow
20:07 * -> esden gots his mails deliverd directly to his server and reads them there ;-)
20:07 < daja77> you are the lucky one
20:07 < esden> ssh is your friend ...
20:07 < esden> daja77: yes you can say that ... 
20:08 < esden> daja77: yes ... it is somewhat painfull ... but I sometimes have to use the client in my uni ... and it is mutt and uses imap ... it works perfectly
20:08 < wosch> I got my mail at hostsharing. I hope I can convince them to support ETRN some day, that would be great
20:09 < tcr> daja77: I'm currently having a discussion about the starts step of magmav2. Though it's near to end now ;)
20:09 < daja77> I'd like to use mutt, but don't have a server of my own
20:09 < tcr> daja77: Are you primarely interested in helpin`?
20:09 < daja77> tcr: depends, how and where?
20:09 < tcr> daja77: #freebits ...
20:10 < esden> magmav2 ?
20:10 < daja77> on this network? :)
20:10 < tcr> ye
20:10 < tcr> esden: http://freebits.de/magma/MagmaV2/MagmaV2_thoughts_and_ideas.txt
20:10 < capchaos> btw, anyone using mutt with some kind of forwarding to gmx ?
20:10 < ^wolf^> tcr: i send the "several cvs versions" request to rock-linux@rocklinux.org ?
20:11 < tcr> ^wolf^: several cvs versions?
20:11 < tcr> ^wolf^: you rather mean several package version at once
20:11 < ^wolf^> oh, i thought of being able to select cvs versions, but several package versions is what i finally want, yes
20:13 < ^wolf^> but the email-address is the right one?
20:13 < tcr> ^wolf^: Well, what's lacking is the online viewer of cvs to actually see what cvs you want. Getting them is possible
20:13 < ^wolf^> or should i use the package list
20:13 < tcr> no, it's right
20:13 < ^wolf^> ok
20:13 < ^wolf^> danke :)
20:14 < esden> hmm .. very interesting
20:14 < esden> tcr: thanks for the url 
20:19 < ^wolf^> mail sent
20:24 < wosch> so, we know the best mailer now...
20:24 < wosch> whats the best MTA?
20:24 < wosch> sendmail, postfix, exim, qmail?
20:24 < ^wolf^> postfix (in my view)
20:24 < wosch> anyone dares to name exchange? :)
20:24 * blindcoder taking a shower
20:24 < ^wolf^> i havent tried exim myself tho
20:24 < blindcoder> g'night
20:24 < wosch> wolf: agree!
20:25 < ^wolf^> especially the snapshot version with sender verification
20:26 < wosch> whats this?
20:26 < ^wolf^> i hope that feature goes into the official version soon, so i can convince the people at work that i install it on our gateways
20:26 < wosch> I just installed 2.0.7 last week, to get smtp auth
20:26 < ^wolf^> if blah9999@yahoo.com sends a mail
20:26 < ^wolf^> the postfix snapshot asks the MX for yahoo.com
20:27 < ^wolf^> if it accepts mail for blah9999@yahoo.com at all
20:27 < ^wolf^> and if not, it rejects the mail
20:27 < wosch> nice idea
20:27 < ^wolf^> stops a lot of spam
20:27 < wosch> *nod*
20:28 < ^wolf^> i have been using the snapshot for months now on mail.blinde-kuh.de
20:28 < ^wolf^> without any problems
20:29 < wosch> hmm... however... does that still work if postfix's incoming is fed from a fetchmail run?
20:29 < ^wolf^> yes, why not
20:29 < ^wolf^> fetchmail sends mail via the SMTP port
20:29 < wosch> if postfix rejects a mail, then fetchmail might just leave it hanging around on the pop3 server?
20:29 < ^wolf^> so the smtpd rules work
20:30 < ^wolf^> you must then configure fetchmail to dump it i guess
20:30 < wosch> luckily we don't get much spam yet
20:32 < blindcoder> hm... no shower yet...
20:33 < blindcoder> tcr: so magmav2 should become a console-type arson?
20:33 < tcr> arson?
20:34 < blindcoder> tcr: a KDE-Wrapper for: cdparanoia, mpg123, ogg123, cdrecord, cdrdao etc.
20:34 < blindcoder> tcr: with freedb support et al
20:34 < blindcoder> tcr: burning/ripping CDDA, writing Data-CDs all nicely wrapped up in a KDE-GUI
20:35 < tcr> blindcoder: Hmm. it's actually "just" an extendend magmav1 version rewritten in C and that's way with much more features and user friendlyness
20:35 * wosch rolls on the floow laughing.
20:35 < blindcoder> tcr: actually, I haven't ever heard heard of magmav1, just read that mail you linked :)
20:35 < tcr> http://freebits.de/magma/about.html
20:36 < wosch>  /etc/postfix/main.cf: smtpd_banner = $myhostname ESMTP MS Exchange 0.01alpha pre-test
20:36 * rxr backscrolled
20:36 < rxr> the last snapshot is pretty old - use an CVS checkout ... ,-)
20:36 < tcr> blindcoder: But yes it's actually exactly that I aim
20:37 < tcr> what
20:37 < blindcoder> tcr: sweet :)
20:37 < blindcoder> esden: ping
20:39 < blindcoder> hehe, somehow I like perl...
20:39 < blindcoder> bless $user; # :)
20:39 < blindcoder> aah... the shower i-s free... bbl
20:46 < wosch> how hard is it to install a java jre into rock for mozilla to use?
20:47 < daja77> wosch: should be easy
20:47 < wosch> i never succeeded on a suse, but let's go for a fresh try. I wanna get rid of suse, anyway...
20:48 < daja77> wosch: good decision, for java just grab a tarball and follow the install instructions
20:48 < daja77> did that on SuSE and RedHat
20:52 < wosch> daja77: You mean that tarball directly from java.sun.com j2re_1.4.1_linux-something.bin ?
20:52 < daja77> I mean that from www.blackdown.org
20:53 < wosch> oops... ok, i check
20:54 < blindcoder> aaah
20:54 < blindcoder> better :)
20:55 < wosch> maybe that's why i always failed to install java...
20:56 < tcr> ^wolf^: I havent received any mail from you so far...
20:57 -!- holyolli [~holyolli@217.14.168.2] has quit ("Hey!  Where'd my controlling terminal go?")
20:58 < ^wolf^> From: Minimalist Manager <minimalist@rocklinux.org>
20:58 < ^wolf^> To: wolfgang <spamfiltered@gmx.net>
20:58 < ^wolf^> ERROR:
20:58 < ^wolf^>     You (spamfiltered@gmx.net) are not subscribed to this list.
20:58 < daja77> ^wolf^: subscribing is easy, just do it
20:58 < tcr> Hmm :-/
20:59 < ^wolf^> daja77: i dont want to be on the list
20:59 < daja77> ^wolf^: can't help it
21:06 -!- blindcod1r [blindcoder@p50801A0E.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #rocklinux
21:09 -!- blindcoder [blindcoder@pD9E4FD7B.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit (Read error: 60 (Operation timed out))
21:11 -!- blindcod1r is now known as blindcoder
21:33 < wosch> rxr: konsole has a problem with pty's on your last alpha
21:45 * blindcoder going to bed
21:46 < tcr> gn8 bl
21:46 < tcr> gn8 blindcoder
21:51 -!- holyolli [~holyolli@217.14.168.2] has joined #rocklinux
21:51 < holyolli> re
21:51 < daja77> hi holyolli
21:51 < holyolli> hi daja77
21:52 < daja77> holyolli: what's up?
21:52 < holyolli> daja: not that much...irc'in and havin' a bud... ;-)
21:53 < daja77> that means fun :)
21:53 < holyolli> daja: no, it's okay..yesterday was a big oarty, so i have to recover a little bit ;-)
21:54 < holyolli> s/oarty/party
21:54 < daja77> oh what did you celebrate?
21:54 < holyolli> the other class here at the campus had their last check and they may now travel home
21:55 < holyolli> and they had beer and other drinks for free =)
21:55 < daja77> holyolli: where are you from?
21:55 < daja77> :)
21:55 < holyolli> i'm from germany
21:55 < daja77> me too :)
21:55 < holyolli> but at the moment i live in the u.s. :-/
21:56 < daja77> where?
21:56 < holyolli> phoenix/arizona
21:56 < daja77> have you also switched to dst?
21:56 < holyolli> dst?
21:57 < daja77> daylight saving time
21:57 < holyolli> ah
21:57 < holyolli> nope
21:57 < daja77> good
21:57 < holyolli> so we're 9hours behind germany
21:58 < daja77> whow that's more than Mike1 is behind :)
21:58 < holyolli> jepp
21:59 < daja77> happy afternoon :)
21:59 < holyolli> *g*
21:59 < holyolli> thx
21:59 < holyolli> .oo(just the right time to get on the pool
21:59 < holyolli> )
21:59 < holyolli> ;-)
21:59 < daja77> ok have fun, cu
22:00 < holyolli> the nice thing is that i installed wavelan and so you can sit outside on the pool and surf'in the web ;-)
22:00 < daja77> we have wlan at university but no pool :(
22:01 < wosch> nite
22:01 -!- wosch [~wosch@p508173FA.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit ()
22:12 < rxr> re
22:13 < holyolli> re rxr
22:19 < rxr> hi holyolli
22:24 < tcr> rxr: did you CCd to wolfang?
22:25 < rxr> errrrrrrrrr oops ;-)
22:28 < rxr> resend to him in To: only ... ;-)
22:33 < rxr> holyolli: how are your alpha buils doing ?
22:34 < holyolli> rxr: at the moment not that much, because i'm round about 5000miles away from my alpha :(
22:34 < ^wolf^> so the reply is "you're lost if you are looking for kde 3.0*, use the latest or die"
22:34 < holyolli> so rebooting really sucks ;)
22:34 < holyolli> rxr: i'm thinking of movin over to 1.7 - because 1.6 don't look that good.. ;)
22:35 < rxr> ^wolf^: why do you need kde-3.0.0 ???
22:35 < ^wolf^> because i dislike 3.1
22:36 < ^wolf^> its icons stink ;)
22:36 < rxr> holyolli: that would be nice. Maybe you read that we plan a stable 2.0 release in April/May. Would be nice to have some Alpha ISOs then ... ;-)
22:36 < tcr> ^wolf^: no, you still can use CVS to get the packages versions you need.
22:36 < rxr> ^wolf^: you only dislike 3.1 because of it's icons???
22:36 < ^wolf^> rxr: kmail has changed in some details
22:36 < rxr> IIRC all the 3.0 Icons are still present
22:36 < tcr> rxr: Why hasnt clifford set up an online viewer for his cvs server yet?
22:36 < ^wolf^> and i want to keep the 3.0.5 version
22:36 < rxr> or install an icon theme you like ...
22:37 < ^wolf^> its not just the icon themes
22:37 < rxr> tcr: don't now - nobody requested one so far ... ;-)
22:37 < ^wolf^> i had 3.1 in debian and removed it again
22:37 < holyolli> rxr: do you know how far esden is with his alpha work?
22:38 < tcr> rxr: Erm. Quite a lot people requested it (might have been in your "inactive" phase)
22:38 < rxr> kde-3.1 finaly moved me to this platform ... (before that I used blackbox/waimea/windowmaker with the KDE applications ...
22:38 < rxr> =
22:38 < rxr> holyolli: no sorry - I have not heared much about alpha
22:38 < ^wolf^> i use XFce with some kde applications
22:39 < rxr> tcr: hm I only had a IRC inactive phase - patch-sending-wise I was active the whole winter ... ;-)
22:39 < tcr> rxr: With an online viewer ^wolf^'s problem would be quite easily solvable: He just has to take a look what cvs tag version the packages/kde directory was the update, and just checkouts one version before
22:39 < ^wolf^> tcr: good point
22:40 < tcr> I know there was a discussion about the online viewer, and at least three people clearly spoke for it... Clifford seems to have overseen that
22:40 < rxr> tcr: since KDE compiles that flawlessly - he could simple "sed" the version number from 3.1.1 to 3.0.5 ...
22:40 < tcr> unfortuntely the search engine of the mailinglist sucks plain ass, otherwise I could proof that by fact ;)
22:41 < rxr> tcr: /me too ... - I also missed a online-browseable view of the files at work, too
22:41 < tcr> rxr: No! Think just about eventual patches etc
22:41 < rxr> the last snapshot browsing is indeed too old ...
22:41 < rxr> tcr: there were non ;-)
22:41 < rxr> kde compiles out of the box.
22:41 < holyolli> rxr: btw. have you tested drock already on a laptop?
22:43 < tcr> rxr: I don't talk about that specific problem... It'd be just good to _have_ the possiblity. I mean even when rocklinux won't ever contain several packages versions at once, anyone can still do that via CVS quite easiely
22:43 < rxr> erhm the 2.0.0-alpha?
22:43 < rxr> tcr: sure.
22:44 -!- A-Tui [~Aitor@cable87a195.usuarios.retecal.es] has joined #rocklinux
22:44 < A-Tui> hi guys
22:45 < rxr> the last erhm was for holyolli ...
22:45 < tcr> hi atui
22:45 < A-Tui> hi tcr
22:45 < holyolli> ah
22:45 < holyolli> rxr: for example...
22:46 < rxr> what are you interested in?
22:46 < daja77> hi A-Tui
22:46 < A-Tui> hola daja77
22:46 < rxr> I normally run them on my low-cost Gericom laptop ...
22:46 < holyolli> rxr: just to install it on my vaio...
22:46 < rxr> hm the very slim-line one ?
22:46 < daja77> A-Tui: btw, what does hola mean?
22:46 < rxr> that needs special CD hacks or so ?
22:47 < A-Tui> hello :)
22:47 < holyolli> rxr: jepp, a r505-ecp
22:47 < A-Tui> and btw?
22:47 < holyolli> rxr: the cdrom is firewire. wavelan with pcmcia and intel onboard chipset
22:47 < rxr> hm - since I do not have such hardware ... ...
22:47 < holyolli> rxr: does the kernel have ntfs included?
22:47 < daja77> A-Tui: by the way
22:47 < A-Tui> ok
22:47 < rxr> holyolli: no ntfs should I add read-only support?
22:48 < rxr> (I just disabled firewire - I should turn it on again ;-)?
22:48 < holyolli> rxr: well, due to the fact, that most of the laptops have windows xp, etc. preinstalled, you can just copy the cd on the ntfs-partition and install the system from there
22:48 < rxr> good point
22:49 < holyolli> rxr: i think those vaios need some more kernel-patches. it would help much
22:49 < rxr> holyolli: is this a very new vaio ?
22:49 < holyolli> i actually built a kernel with some patches, but firewire isn't still working
22:49 * rxr is currently searching for a new laptop ;-)
22:49 < holyolli> rxr: not _that_ new, but also not very old
22:50 < daja77> holyolli: the firewall stuff is still experimental
22:50 < rxr> holyolli: URL ? ;-) (with feature list and price?)
22:50 < holyolli> rxr: mompl
22:51 < rxr> btw are you in germany in the next weeks/months?
22:51 < daja77> rxr: what about a powerbook?
22:51 < holyolli> rxr: i come back at the end of july... :(
22:51 < holyolli> .oO(4 more months...arrg)
22:51 < rxr> daja77: too expensive - otherwise it would be already on my desk ;-)
22:52 < holyolli> rxr: for quick specs, just look on ebay.com and search for 'sony vaio r505'
22:52 < rxr> holyolli: Hm. I asked because the low-speed models of IBM thinkpads are only available in the US ...
22:52 < holyolli> ah..
22:52 < daja77> rxr: but I wouldn't like to buy a gericom again
22:53 < rxr> daja77: jupa /me too. But at this time I had not more money to spent ...
22:53 < daja77> my sister bought a vobis labeled laptop with athlon 1600 in it
22:54 < rxr> daja77: my current favourite are iBook or IBM thinkpad
22:54 -!- tfing [~tfing@ASt-Lambert-101-1-1-213.abo.wanadoo.fr] has joined #rocklinux
22:54 < daja77> hmm watch out that that thinkpad works properly under linux
22:54 < tfing> plop
22:55 < rxr> daja77: I do not need high-speed. I need low-weight and long up time on akku ...
22:55 < holyolli> rxr: actually i can't find the url.its a model which is not available in europe
22:55 < holyolli> rxr: but it's nice, 3.5h on battery and really nice to work with
22:55 < daja77> me too, but I could my first rock build on it :)
22:56 < holyolli> rxr: you can read this: http://www.jaj.com/space/gunderwood/Laptop.html
22:56 < holyolli> rxr: it's about installing linux on those vaios
22:56 < rxr> urgs - quite long
22:56 < holyolli> rxr: jepp, but with very much information and specs and patches ;)
22:57 < daja77> rxr: maybe you want to have a look at http://www.xtops.de
22:58 < tcr> daja77: I still can't see what's so good on a thinkpad. It's almost as expensive as a powerbook but isn't far less feature rich
22:58 < rxr> Sony Vaio R505 Laptop w/Docking Bay
22:58 < rxr> $7.50
22:58 < rxr> $3.75
22:58 < rxr> hm.
22:59 < tcr> but it IS far less feature rich
22:59 < rxr> They will go up in the next 6 hours, won't they ?
22:59 < daja77> tcr: I'm not into thinkpads so much
22:59 < tcr> daja77: just look at the specs at xtops
23:00 < rxr> tcr: the low-speed Rxx thinkpads are much cheaper than a power book ...
23:00 < daja77> I've seen it, the point is only that you can get preinstalled linux laptops there
23:00 < daja77> but the page is quite outdated
23:00 < rxr> daja77: preinstalled? urgs
23:00 < rxr> I do not want any OS on the thing ... :-(
23:00 < rxr> The latest dRock build will end up on it anyway ...
23:00 < daja77> rxr: you don't have to
23:02 < daja77> better look at heuser's non commercial page http://www.tuxmobil.de/mylaptops_de.html
23:02 < tcr> well but the 12" powerbooks are quite "cheap" (for apple)
23:03 < rxr> daja77: thanks - but I really do not need help on installing Linux on a laptop ... ;-)
23:04 < rxr> tcr: the 12" bowerbook also doesn't include PCMCIA ...
23:04 < daja77> I know, but it is a list of laptop with the user's experience
23:04 < rxr> shit
23:04 < rxr> http://www.apple.com/powerbook/index17.html#
23:04 < rxr> reveals a new font problem in our XFree KDE combination ... :-(
23:05 < rxr> daja77: you are a powerpc fan ?
23:05 < tcr> rxr: Well, many things are builtin, and for everything else there's still USB...
23:05 < daja77> rxr: huh? tcr is trying to convince you
23:06 < tcr> I'm simple myself about buying a 12" ;)
23:06 < tcr> simply
23:06 < rxr> ah ;-) I also have powerpc on my preferred CPU list ;-)
23:06 < daja77> rxr: nvidia hardware shouldn't be the problem
23:06 < rxr> if those iBook would have PCMCIA ....
23:07 < rxr> daja77: urghs - no stay away with nvidia. I'll not put binary only modules into my systems ram ...
23:07 * daja77 gets an old iMac just for fun
23:07 < rxr> tcr: hm the 12" thing starts at $1,799.00 ?
23:08 < daja77> rxr: the cards work fine, and it's the only choice on linux for real 3d acceleration
23:08 < rxr> hm - and includes nvidia crap ... :-(
23:08 < rxr> daja77: no ati is the choise ...
23:08 < daja77> binary ati drivers, yeah that really improves everything
23:08 < rxr> aside from my MGA 450 just working great
23:09 < rxr> daja77: no the Radeon 7xxx work with the oper-source GPL code ...
23:09 < tcr> rxr: Yeah, though I'd buy the superdrive for 1999$
23:09 < daja77> but without 3D acceleration
23:09 < rxr> (sad that Matrox is not releaseing specs for the parhelia ...
23:10 < daja77> if you just need 2d the nv driver should work
23:10 < tcr> Though powerbooks are said to be a pile of frustrations for linux installations. But I only know that from hairsaying ;)
23:10 < daja77> tcr: they are
23:10 < rxr> hm calculating the trip-costs for a ROCK devel meeting in Vienna and the linuxtag in karlsruhe I might not have that much money to spend for an laptop ...
23:11 < rxr> daja77: when I buy a recent GPU I want OpenGL running ... not just a 2D only solution ...
23:11 < daja77> rxr: I feel with you, cannot afford a new laptop myself
23:11 < rxr> and yes the GPL dirver for Radeon does OpenGL utilizing the hardware.
23:12 < daja77> than you have other information than me
23:13 < tcr> They can
23:13 < rxr> I have those running ...
23:13 < rxr> http://dri.sourceforge.net/
23:13 < rxr> -> Status link
23:13 < rxr> Mach64 (Rage Pro)
23:13 < rxr> Rage 128 (Standard, Pro, Mobility)
23:13 < daja77> ok that sounds good, unfortunately those drivers weren't ready when I bought my last card
23:13 < rxr> Radeons up to R9200 are supported
23:13 < daja77> sounds good
23:15 < daja77> I do consider buying ATI then :)
23:15 < tcr> Heh... ({ }) expressions (gcc C extension) rule
23:15 < rxr> tcr: hm? what does those braces do ?
23:16 < tcr> int bar = ({ int i; for (i=0; i<BLAH; i++) do something: i; })
23:17 < tcr> something;
23:17 < rxr> hm interesting
23:17 < tcr> exactly what I needed in my case ;)
23:17 < tcr> And the kernel makes also heavy use of this feature
23:41 < holyolli> o.k. /me has to learn a little bit...cya
23:41 -!- holyolli [~holyolli@217.14.168.2] has quit ("ircII EPIC4-1.0.1 -- Are we there yet?")
23:45 -!- capchaos [~capchaos@frn3-d9b957b7.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit ("Da steh ich nun, ich armer Tor, und bin so klug als wie zuvor.")
23:49 < owl> hi
23:49 < ^wolf^> that build had a bad start, the kernel source didnt work, downloading a fresh copy from kernel.org seems to have fixed that
23:51 < tcr> Hmm, do you build from that snapshot, or did you copy the kde related files to a more recent version?
23:51 < ^wolf^> i build from that snapshot
23:51 < tcr> Hmm...
23:52 < tcr> I don't recommend that though.
23:52 < ^wolf^> would i just have to copy all files from the kde-30 folder ?
23:53 < tcr> Yeah.. and maybe also tinker some things... rxr?
23:54 < ^wolf^> looks like i need to subscribe to the ML huh ;)
23:55 < rxr> ^wolf^: which files do you want to copy to which location ?
23:55 < tcr> He simply wants to use the old kde 3.0 files of that snapshot
23:56 < ^wolf^> i would like to use the kde-30 files in a current 1.7 installation
23:56 < tcr> Basically he has to move that directory to the directory of more recent sources
23:56 < tcr> and symlink from kde-3.1 to kde-3.0? And run scripts/Puzzle?
23:56 < rxr> scripts/Puzzle ? err this isn't in 1.7 ...
23:57 < tcr> Hmm? Latest I checked it was... huhm
23:57 < ^wolf^> ;)
23:57 < rxr> the scripts exists
23:57 < rxr> but only performs some text editing (LSM and so)
23:57 < rxr> nothing package related. ...
23:58 < tcr> Oh, ok.
23:58 < rxr> tcr: simply copy the kde-30 folder into packages
23:58 < tcr> say that to wolf 8)
23:59 < rxr> when you do not need kde related packages (like mosfet-liquid or so) exclude the new 31 packages in the ROCK Linux configuration
23:59 < ^wolf^> ok
23:59 < rxr> tcr: yes .... /me busy coding s.th. ...
23:59 < rxr> but koffice and kdevelop will not build this way
23:59 < daja77> I'm off now gn8
23:59 < rxr> you need to adapte the inclusion of the kde config script in those .desc files
--- Log closed Mon Mar 31 00:00:04 2003