--- Log opened Son Nov 09 00:00:16 2003
00:58 < netrunner> n8 daja77 
00:58 < netrunner> mnemoc: I took that quoting from the other lines to be consistent.
01:00  * netrunner wonders what sildenafil citrate is
01:01 < netrunner> anyway, I didn't order any limited time discount on it ;)
01:10 < mnemoc> netrunner: m4 uses that discusting quoting :|
01:11 < mnemoc> your patch is better than mine... i forgot the fact you may what to have swap on raid or lvm
01:12 < mnemoc> how does raidstart reacts if raidtab is empty?
01:17 < netrunner> mnemoc: cannot determine md version: no MD device file in /dev
01:18 < netrunner> by default there is none.
01:18 < netrunner> and swap on lvm is a bad idea. I do not know how that is on softraid though.
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01:35 < mnemoc> netrunner: maybe you should use -s /etc/raidtab instead of -f for avoiding that error
01:37 < mnemoc> i know swap on lvm is BAD, but... this is a DBK... i put lvm stuff after swapon, you put raid stuff before swapon
01:37 < mnemoc> i wonder what's the right way
01:38 < mnemoc> swap on raid (any raid) is almost as bad as swap on lvm
01:41 < netrunner> mnemoc: well, i do not know about sw raid, but hw could give you performance boost. my theory :)
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09:24 < cchamilt> OK, now that I am awake, just some comments on partitions and various raids.  softraids should not be built on lvms, the other way around is fine.  So for the most part raidstart shouldn't need called except on RAID creation.  New lvms these days should probably have an evms wrapper(as its snapshotting, etc. will work on current kernels and more likely future ones).  All of these software based systems should not have swap on them.  
10:19 < netrunner> you need raidstart if you haven't activated scanning for raids in your kernel conf iirc. but I will check that after preparing/having breakfast
10:20 < netrunner> moin btw :)
10:24 < netrunner> can't find the option right now, but I remember there is a autostart raid devices.
10:24  * netrunner -> breakfast
10:24 < holyolli> moin all together :)
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10:32 < netrunner> hi holyolli 
10:32 < holyolli> moin netrunner
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10:43 < blindcoder> ll
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10:43 < blindcoder> oops
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10:48 < blindcoder> moin all
10:48 < holyolli> moin blindcoder
10:49 < blindcoder> anyone got some idea about WLAN-Access Points and law?
10:49 < blindcoder> to be more precise: could my nneighbor make me shutdown the AP because of "Strahlung"?
10:52 < holyolli> blindcoder: i don't think so..and how does he know that you have an ap?
10:53 < holyolli> blindcoder: and btw. all radiation products in germany need a certificate vom Tuev and Post/Telekom to operate
10:53 < blindcoder> holyolli: well, he will know once I sit in the garden with my laptop :)
10:53 < holyolli> blindcoder: *lol* that's right
10:54 < holyolli> blindcoder: and from the practical point of view has a cordless (home-)phone more radiation than an AP
10:55 < blindcoder> holyolli: hmm... okay, then I should be fine with the two APs that I'll need :)
10:55 < holyolli> here in bremen even the stadtwerke use some kind of wavelan-technology to connect some trainsigns
10:55 < holyolli> blindcoder: why do you need 2?
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10:56 < blindcoder> One for the upper two floors, and one that works as a bridge and connects the first floor and basement
10:57 < blindcoder> the one I want to have doesn't have enough power to connect all four floors
10:58 < holyolli> and what about those repeaters from dlink? we've used them in our 'wg' when we were in the US to connect 2 buildings and they went fine
10:58 < blindcoder> I don't know about those... i'll go have a look at them
10:59 < holyolli> we had a DWL-614+ as the base station and the DI-800AP+ as reapeaters
10:59 < holyolli> just look on dlink.com
11:00 < holyolli> the only problem is that you can't chain those repeaters, because then the bandwidth is going down
11:01 < holyolli> ups...the repeater was a DWL-900AP+...
11:01 < holyolli> _not_ the 800
11:03 < blindcoder> looks nice
11:03 < blindcoder> does this repeater work with any AP or only DLink-APs?
11:03 < holyolli> blindcoder: hm. i don't know. never tested it...which ap did you plan to use?
11:04 < blindcoder> A NetGear, don't know the exact number by heart now
11:05 < holyolli> hm. i could test it with a linksys...but not the next days
11:05 < holyolli> or just search some faq's, etc.
11:06 < blindcoder> will do so. Thanks!
11:06 < holyolli> np
11:06 < holyolli> blindcoder: if you need some more info about that, just mail me, because i'm learing for some exams and therefore i'm quiet rare in this channel ;-)
11:08 < blindcoder> holyolli: okay. I should leave now again, too. I have been in bed since Friday and not 100% healthy again with a jab interview tomorrow >_<
11:08 < blindcoder> s/jab/job/
11:10 < holyolli> blindcoder: gute besserung :)
11:10 < holyolli> blindcoder: and good luck
11:11 < blindcoder> thanks :)
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11:55 < netrunner> blindcoder: wlan ap operate in a publicly available band, and they have a defined output power that you are allowed to use. he has to _prove_ that he is affected by the radiation. and if he can, what he can't, there has to be a judisdiction that ap's are not allowed. nowhere.
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13:41 < cchamilt> relo
13:43 < cchamilt> netrunner:Been using md for years now. md scans for raids automatically.  It might not if it is a module, but then putting critical storage drivers as modules is kind of goofy.
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13:46 < cchamilt> netrunner: Of course, if it was a module, then devfs/rockplug action on /dev/md should actually be where things like loading the module and scanning should occur.
13:52 < cchamilt> evms should maybe do this too. hmm.
13:56 < cchamilt>  /boot should be on a raid1 by lilo if possible (for drives not recovering), so md and evms tools need to be on initrd.  That sounds like a little bit of work to be in stone.
14:37 < mnemoc> re
14:40 < daja77> hi cchamilt & mnemoc 
14:42 < cchamilt> anybody know any good catalog ware? Hopefully php based.
14:42 < cchamilt> I want to start promoting stuff.
14:43 < mnemoc> cchamilt: no :(
14:43 < mnemoc> daja77: hi 
14:44 < daja77> cchamilt: there is some out there but i forgot the names
14:44 < cchamilt> hmm, guess i should start testing stuff i see on freshmeat.
14:45 < cchamilt> My company needs a real website.
14:45 < daja77> ack *ggg*
14:45 < mnemoc> is usbcore.o inside default rock kernel?
14:45 < daja77> unfortuneately yes
14:46 < mnemoc> then, why rockplug tries to load it as module?
14:46 < daja77> dunno
14:46 < mnemoc> :|
14:46 < daja77> but i hae noticed that too, looks ugly
14:46 < daja77> d'oh
14:48 < mnemoc> cchamilt: can you add to your 'mine' work a remove empty directories on remove PLEASE! :)
14:49 < cchamilt> remove empty directory?
14:50 < mnemoc> yes... is that bad?
14:51 < cchamilt> hmm, I thought it did that.  maybe it doesnt for directories that had things put in it after.
14:51 < cchamilt> ie. it might be empty now. but once held things besides the original package that created it.
14:52 < mnemoc> if get modified, keep forever?
14:52 < cchamilt> yes, i believe that is what we do.
14:53 < cchamilt> I will check into it and see if I can provide at least some solution.
14:53 < mnemoc> thanks
14:54 < cchamilt> no idea if I can, but I will look through that part of the code and see.
14:56 < mnemoc> brb
15:10 < rxr> re
15:10 < daja77> hi rxr
15:33 < rxr> hi daja77 
15:33 < rxr> hi all
15:36 < daja77> how are you
15:46 < AOU> moin
15:50 < holyolli> re'
16:07 < AOU> hi holyolli 
16:07 < holyolli> hi AOU
16:24 < cytrinox`-> moin
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16:28 < fake> hi
16:28 < daja77> hi fake, how are you
16:29 < holyolli> hi fake
16:33 < fake> daja77: thanks, how are you?
16:33 < fake> hi holyolli 
16:33 < daja77> fine :)
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17:23 < blindcoder> hi hi and rehi
17:36 < [anders]> anyone with broadcom or intel wifi products that has no driver at the moment?
17:36 < [anders]> check out http://www.linuxant.com
17:37 < [anders]> v1.33 or later of the driverloader should make these devices work.
17:37 < rxr> hi [anders] 
17:37 < [anders]> lo rxr
17:37 < [anders]> how's things?
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17:44 < blindcoder> [anders]: I already tried those with a Intel PRO/Wireless 2100 last Thursday
17:44 < blindcoder> [anders]: works like a charm ;)
17:46 -!- nookie [~nookie@M317P005.adsl.highway.telekom.at] has joined #rocklinux
17:47 < [anders]> blindcoder: yeah.. :)
17:48 < [anders]> permanent licence is $19.95 as well.. so not too expensive.
17:48 < blindcoder> I haven't found the button for permanent license yet >_<
17:49 < blindcoder> oh, it's there since today... so that's why :P
17:49 < blindcoder> still, I'm not sure whether to be happy or sad of the existence of such a product
17:50 < daja77> definitely sad
17:50 < daja77> loading win* drivers into linux is not the road to go imo
17:50 < blindcoder> hardware manufacturers might think "Linux users can load Windows drivers now, so why should we make drivers for Linux natively?"
17:51 < blindcoder> it's just the same problem as with wine{x,}
17:51 < daja77> we don't wanna have shitty win drivers for a longer period, no?
17:52 < blindcoder> daja77: no, but the companies make the drivers, not we, do we?
17:52 < blindcoder> I have less problems with closed source native drivers than with a driver-wrapper that loads win-drivers, no matter the quality.
17:53 < daja77> developing linux drivers is easier than developing windows drivers, why intel is so incompetent not to have some I can't explain
17:53 < blindcoder> daja77: because of the people buying their technology, the amount of linux-users is marginal?
17:54 < [anders]> blindcoder: perhaps
17:54 < [anders]> rumour has it Intel will release a native driver in 1H 2004.
17:54 < daja77> everybody says we are a linux companies, and when you ask them for drivers they shut up immediately
17:54 < [anders]> on the other hand, rumour had it that they would release same driver in 1H 2003.. and that didn't happen
17:54 < blindcoder> [anders]: hmm... to be honest, if I were Intel, I'd stop development and point linux-users to the wrapper
17:54 < daja77> adn don't tell me it is cos of the cost, this is ridiculous
17:55 < [anders]> blindcoder: yes and no..
17:55 < [anders]> they have beta driver working fine internally..
17:55 < [anders]> they are in same position as with the eepro100 driver..
17:55 < blindcoder> [anders]: well, if they'd at least release those, more people would be happy
17:55 < [anders]> someone external wrote a driver that worked, and then intel realised that they could actually release a driver..
17:56 < [anders]> same will probably happen here.
17:56 < [anders]> there are concerns that under linux you can tell the hardware to do more things that you were not quite supposed to do, that is why they are stalling.
17:56 < blindcoder> personally, I don't care either way. The wrapper works, so I'll use it until it doesn't work anymore.
17:57 < blindcoder> If you can tell the hardware to do more than it should, then the hardware was probably poorly designed... or better than it should have been
18:01 < blindcoder> anyway, I'm off to dinner
18:18 < rxr> nope
18:19 < daja77> huh?
18:19 < rxr> you may be allowed to peform some acitions in wone country - but no in another
18:19 < rxr> different frequencies and such
18:20 < rxr> and the hardware cannot check if the frequencies / signal you put on the wire are in the specs - or trigger special features in the "swiches"
18:20 < rxr> but I think it is not ok this way - and those shit wrappers should not be used
18:20 < daja77> ack
18:21 < rxr> they contradict free software
18:21 < rxr> we can not ship it - it will not work with a 2.7.x or whatever new kernel - it needs special adaptions on their side ...
18:21 < rxr> and it does only run on Intel ...
18:21  * daja77 off to parents ttyl
18:23 < rxr> cu daja77 
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18:39 < robert__> Downloading download/base/strace/strace-4.4.98.tar.bz2 ...
18:39 < robert__> ERROR: According to src/Download-Errors we had already an error for that URL.
18:39 < robert__> ERROR: So I'm not trying to download it again (remove src/Download-Errors
18:39 < robert__> ERROR: if you want to force a retry).
18:39 < robert__> that is the output from .script/Download -required
18:40 < robert__> some ideas? :>
18:41 < rxr> robert__: does only this package fail to download?
18:41 < robert__> no, all
18:42 < rxr> hm - do you use a mirror - or the orignial URL ?
18:42 < robert__> orginal
18:43 < robert__> i have no list with mirror's
18:43 < rxr> you wrote "none" into Download/Mirror ?
18:43 < robert__> no
18:43 < rxr> ok - so the mirror gets (normally) auto-detected ...
18:43 < rxr> what does:
18:43 < rxr>  cat download/Mirror 
18:43 < rxr> reviel ?
18:44 < robert__> no download/mirror exist
18:44 < robert__> ahh, i found :>
18:45 < robert__> hmm. a few packages have error but it load now a package
18:47 < robert__> how long do it download? ( i have dsl)
18:47 < robert__> 2-3h ?
18:47 < rxr> hm for a full build it needs to download ~1.7 GB ...
18:48 < robert__> ok
18:48 < rxr> when you do a Download -cfg your-config-name -required it will only download what the current config would  need for a build ...
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20:01 < elon> hi all
20:02 < elon> anybody using tc or the shaper0 device (for traffic shaping)?
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20:14 -!- Topic for #rocklinux: ROCK Linux approaching 2.0 - join now - http://www.rocklinux.org/rock20.html
20:14 -!- Topic set by ChanServ [] [Sun Aug  3 22:11:35 2003]
20:14 [Users #rocklinux]
20:14 [ [anders] ] [ blindcoder] [ elon   ] [ mnemoc   ] [ rxr     ] 
20:14 [ _spectre_] [ cchamilt  ] [ esden  ] [ netrunne1] [ scoopexH] 
20:14 [ Aard     ] [ clifford  ] [ hannes ] [ netrunner] [ SMP     ] 
20:14 [ AOU      ] [ cytrinox`-] [ kasc   ] [ robert__ ] [ snyke   ] 
20:14 [ aszlig   ] [ daja77    ] [ mistik1] [ rolla    ] [ true    ] 
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20:23 < daja77> re
20:23 < blindcoder> hi hi and rehi
20:23 < blindcoder> anyone of you know MoviX?
20:25 < daja77> blindy: can you give me the url of your hp again pls?
20:25 < rxr> blindcoder: /mw only read the name weeks ago
20:25 < blindcoder> rxr: I see... I just stumbled over it reading my webalizer logs
20:26 < blindcoder> rxr: It's a bootable Video Player, similiar to the Linux Video Project that I started a few weeks ago
20:26 < blindcoder> Seems like they linked me in some news entry...
20:29 < blindcoder> anyway, I've got to go to bed... need to be as healthy as possible tomorrow *ouch* and have been lying in bed since friday >_<
20:29 < blindcoder> good night, everyone!
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21:09 < rxr> re
21:09 < daja77> re rxr
21:10 < rxr> blindcoder: what is the homepage of your project?
21:10 < daja77> http://www.crash-override.net/lvp/
21:15 < rxr> thanks
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22:22 < Moh> hi
22:22 < rxr> hi Moh 
22:22 < Moh> what is the problem here
22:22 < Moh> hi rxr
22:22 < Moh> i want to talk
22:22 < Moh> some talk 
22:22 < Moh> please
22:23 < rxr> we are not a talk-line ...
22:23 < Moh> i know but may you define to me what are you doing here 
22:23 < rxr> ... except you want to talk about $topic ...
22:23 < Moh> i can help
22:23 < rxr> haeh=
22:23 < rxr> ???
22:23 < Moh> anyone
22:23 < Moh> about anything i mean
22:24 < daja77> Moh: ????!
22:24 < Moh> May someone define to me what is rocklinux
22:24 < rxr> http://www.rocklinux.org
22:24 < [anders]> Moh: a flexible linux distribution
22:24 < rxr> readh $topix
22:24 < rxr> $topic even ...
22:25 < rxr> build kit even ...
22:25 < Moh> and is it free
22:25 < Moh> i mean GPLed
22:25 < rxr> you could read this on the homepage
22:26 < rxr> (and yes it is released under the terms of the GPL .... )
22:26 < Moh> May i ask another one
22:26 < Moh> are you all here using rocklinux
22:27 < rxr> Moh: oh my
22:27  * [anders] does.. on two boxes at the moment
22:27 < daja77> sure, why should we be here
22:27 < daja77> if not
22:27 < rxr> if only 23 people in the world would be using ROCK Linux in the world we would be in some serious problems ...
22:27 < rxr> http://www.rocklinux.org/happy-users.html
22:28 < rxr> http://www.rocklinux-consulting.de/
22:28 < [anders]> granted, ROCK isn't as big as SuSE or RedHat, but neither of those is as flexible as ROCK
22:28 < Moh> i am visiting the site already
22:28 < rxr> http://www.rocklinux-consulting.de/products/rock-handbook/
22:28 < rxr> Moh: and _please_ read some lines there ... - thanks
22:28 < Moh> what do you mean by BIG andres
22:29 < [anders]> Moh: in number of users
22:29 < [anders]> there are lots (!) of Linux distributions out there, and there are a few build kits as well.. 
22:29 < elon> mhm 23....  *draws a little pyramid on his screen*
22:30 < Moh> well well
22:30 < Moh> i am getting in the mode
22:30 < [anders]> :)
22:31 < Moh> and now you are developing the ROCKLINUX here
22:31 < Moh> or chatting how to do this
22:31 < rxr> Moh: ROCK Linux is not really developed "here"
22:32 < rxr> here we just support users, talk about our life - or dicuss minor technical issues
22:32 < Moh> sorry get late for getting in mode
22:32 < Moh> frankly it is the first time to use an IRC chat
22:33 < Moh> so it is a problem to deal with 
22:33 < [anders]> Moh: IRC is a great collaboration tool.
22:33 < Moh> i just knew it now
22:33 < Moh> i missed talking to you 
22:34 < Moh> People here you have your own world
22:34 < rxr> hm?
22:34 < daja77> we only paste src code here to annoy some ppl from time to time ;-)
22:34 < Moh> that i was searching for
22:34 < Moh> which laguage are you coding with
22:35 < daja77> /* stmt_types.h - carries declaration of an enum for statement types */
22:35 < daja77> #ifndef __STMT_TYPES_H__
22:35 < daja77> #define __STMT_TYPES_H__
22:35 < daja77> #ifdef _cplusplus
22:35 < daja77> extern "C" {
22:35 < daja77> #endif
22:35 < daja77> /* change this value if you want to inspect deeper nesting levels */
22:35 < daja77> #define __MAX_NESTING_LEVEL 20 
22:35 < daja77> typedef enum statements_enum {
22:36 < daja77> } statement_t;
22:36 < daja77> scnr
22:36 < rxr> daja77: that is a realy briliant idea
22:36 < [anders]> Moh: C, Shell Scripts, Perl, Sed, Awk.. That sort of thing
22:36 < Moh> what does he write now
22:36 < Moh> i don't think that is a kind of C
22:36 < Moh> i know it well
22:37 < Moh> is it python
22:37 < rxr> I should discuss the performance impact of line 4 in detail
22:37 < daja77> roflmaobtcpmp
22:37 < rxr> and also if the statement_t is perfectly efficiant
22:37 < rxr> to bad this needs the next 6 or 8 hours ...
22:37 < daja77> yeah i think it is the best implementation we ever had to solve this problem
22:38 < Moh> which problem
22:38 < Moh> may i get something in my head
22:38 < daja77> to save all our statements we make here
22:38 < rxr> ok - I'm back after evaluating this piece in full detail
22:38 < rxr> cu late
22:38 < rxr> r
22:38 < daja77> cu rxr
22:38 < Moh> daja77
22:39 < Moh> may you tell me more about your self
22:39  * daja77 is the terror of this chan
22:40 < Moh> terror
22:40 < Moh> i don't know
22:40 < Moh> tell me more
22:40 < Moh> ok let me know more about you
22:40 < rxr> Moh: we want to discuss technical problems here
22:40 < Moh> ok
22:40 < Moh> i will hear only
22:41 < Moh> :(
22:41 < rxr> Moh: until now we just joked arround, but if you are not willing to read the documentation provided or ask technical questions we have to bann you from this channel
22:42 < Moh> documentation
22:42 < Moh> i don't know about
22:43 < rxr> Moh: see the URLs I posted in the beginning - and now better be silent if you do not wanna be kicked out
22:44 -!- Moh [~ibm_linux@62.139.109.75] has quit "Client Exiting"
22:45 < rxr> ibm_linux ?
22:46 < [anders]> no such thing
22:46 -!- mistik1 [rasta@ool-44c02046.dyn.optonline.net] has quit Remote closed the connection
22:46 < daja77> real name was mohamed ...
22:46 -!- mistik1 [rasta@ool-44c02046.dyn.optonline.net] has joined #rocklinux
22:46 < rxr> daja77: jups - read this ...
23:02 -!- elon [~moep2k@pD9E76DAF.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit ".."
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23:21 -!- mistik1 [rasta@ool-44c02046.dyn.optonline.net] has quit Read error: 113 (No route to host)
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23:58 < rxr> HEAD stage 9 rebuild should be fixed now ..
--- Log closed Mon Nov 10 00:00:34 2003