--- Log opened Sat Jun 12 00:00:11 2004
00:03 < rxr> someone awake ?
00:03 < rxr> mnemoc: ?
00:03 < mnemoc> yep
00:04 < daja77> me too
00:05 < rxr> ah cool
00:05 < mnemoc> hi daja77 
00:05 < rxr> can you quickly review:
00:05 < rxr> 2004061200031831362
00:05 < rxr> I want to apply it directly also in 2.0-stable
00:07 -!- Netsplit vinge.freenode.net <-> irc.freenode.net quits: th_, Freak, nookie_, snafu_, Vroum, StefanG, togg
00:08 -!- Netsplit over, joins: nookie_, th_, Freak, Vroum, snafu_, StefanG, togg
00:10 < mnemoc> applyed directly to a running machine
00:11 < mnemoc> it seem to work :)
00:12 < rxr> write ok - when you think I should apply it ...
00:12 < rxr> (me also tested this during writing - but cut'n pasted into another file afterwards ...)
00:13 < mnemoc> it has done everything as expected
00:13 < mnemoc> then: ok to me
00:18 < rxr> ok
00:18 < rxr> thanks
00:18 < rxr> we need more wizards in this module
00:18 < rxr> e.g. a wireless and ppp one ...
00:19 < rxr> my girlfriend was not that pleased by the network configuratoin ...
00:20 < mnemoc> rock has some weakness in user-friendlyness
00:20 < mnemoc> but i love rocknet as is ;)
00:20 -!- Lorini [~Andrea@stdw-wh-vip63.studentenwerk-bielefeld.de] has joined #RockLinux
00:20 < rxr> only the core - and/or the stone frontend as well?
00:21 < mnemoc> i would like to change order without removing and readding but 'edit network/config' solves the problem
00:22 < daja77> rxr: have you experiened that emoyt fstab problem whe using stone for install too?
00:22 < rxr> no - but it as a 2.0 ...
00:22 < rxr> did you install 2.1 ?
00:22 < rxr> I can imagine s.th.
00:23 < mnemoc> i think i have applied all your patches to rocknet....
00:23 < mnemoc> 2.0 to has has only created empty fstabs
00:24 < rxr> hm - a no, can't be a sort, head or tail problem
00:24 < mnemoc> s/to has/to mes/
00:24 < daja77> rxr: yes 2.1
00:24 < daja77> the install in the emulator
00:24 < daja77> but iirc netrunner got that too
00:24 < rxr> mnemoc: the fstab generation failed for you in 2.0 ?
00:25 < mnemoc> yep
00:26 < rxr> stange
00:26 < rxr> strange
00:26 < rxr> you should have debugged the stone_mode_install immidiately ...
00:26 < rxr> alsways worked her eup to now ...
00:27 < rxr> such a lag in ssh sucks ...
00:28 < mnemoc> lag sucks
00:28 < mnemoc> i was with a customer i can't debug in front of him :)
00:29 < mnemoc> i'll test my next build on qemu and debug if needed
00:29 < rxr> mnemoc:  ;-)
00:30 < rxr> just tell him this is normal behaviour and vreate a fstab using vi silently ?
00:30 < mnemoc> apropos SM messages... Alejandro Mery:\n\tupdated $pkg ($ver) ($reason)    ?
00:31 < rxr> reason isoptional and if present not in braces just after the ($ver), optionally seperated using a -
00:31 < mnemoc> i 'silently' render fstab using sed -e '...' /proc/mounts > /etc/fstab   and _tuned_ it by hand ;)
00:32 < daja77> mnemoc: you tried qemu?
00:32 < mnemoc> not yet but i trust you
00:32 < daja77> :D
00:33 < mnemoc> rxr: if it's to long? only short $reason allowed?
00:33 < rxr> no - reasons can be mulitple lines
00:34 < rxr> but it is best to indent them properly then:
00:34 < mnemoc> what should i send to get "* blah\n  blah" and "*blah\n * blah"?
00:34 < rxr>       * updated sed (4.0.9) - incooperated the fix for one of the
00:35 < rxr>         many matching segmentation faults
00:35 < rxr> the indenter has two modes:
00:36 < rxr> 1) no circles detected: fixup as much as possible, try to indent
00:36 < rxr> 2) circles (*) detected: do not reindent that heavily and fix less
00:37 < daja77> is there an update patch in submaster?
00:37 < rxr> so if you want to have the paragraphs untouched, make sure you use the circles at the right places and they will be keept
00:37 < rxr> kept even
00:37 < rxr> daja77: for sed?
00:38 < rxr> daja77: this was only an example - no update ...
00:38 < mnemoc> \t[ ]*\*blah <--- this will be preserved?
00:39 < rxr> mnemoc: hm - I can not parse this correctly, do you mean:
00:39 < rxr> \t * start of text
00:39 < rxr> \t   some more
00:39 < rxr> \t * the next thing
00:39 < rxr> then yes - this will be kept
00:40 < rxr> I also try to improve the indenting of the old sloppy texts later
00:40 < rxr> there is room for improvements, but I did not wanted to invest more time into this at that day ...
00:41 < daja77> rxr: actually there is a sed 4.0.9 ...
00:42 < rxr> hey ! this is voodoo
00:42 < daja77> *gg*
00:42 < mnemoc> ^^
00:43 < daja77> should i prepare an update patch
00:43 < rxr> sure
00:44 < daja77> k.
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00:54 < daja77> done
01:10 < daja77> oops the ftp sites staes sed 4.0.9 is available since jan 1st
01:10 < daja77> guess we should review our versions
01:12 < rxr> hm - for so long?
01:12 < rxr> I often updated sed - due to problems we reported ...
01:12 < daja77> seems so
01:13 < rxr> oh - the last update is really some time ago:
01:13 < rxr> 2003-11-10
01:13 < rxr> updated sed (4.0.8)
01:13 < rxr> anyway - as long as there is no problem with a tool it is ok
01:14 < daja77> hm
01:14 < rxr> uglier are "update just as we can" which break stuff (like the floods on the mailinglist we had in the past)
01:16 < daja77> apart from gcc-3.4 which packages do you mean?
01:17 < mnemoc> ./scripts/Check-PkgVersion is a good friend :)
01:20 < rxr> daja77: years ago when people dumped updates into rock-linux that have been complete untested
01:20 < rxr> some did not even compile - some broke other things ...
01:20 < rxr> nothing recent
01:20 < daja77> ah k. thought you were refering to recent stuff
01:20 < mnemoc> dark ages?
01:21 < daja77> good :)
01:22 < rxr> mnemoc: mid ages
01:22  * daja77 removing 2.0.1 builds to get free disc space
01:22 < mnemoc> :)
01:22 < rxr> mnemoc: how do you use Check-PkgVersion
01:22 < rxr> I always found it quite annoying and several times thought about "fixing" it ...
01:23 < mnemoc> i let it run over my repos and the packages i'm interested
01:24 < mnemoc> then less checkver/*.msg
01:24 < mnemoc> and on a different term i paste stuff to ./scripts/Create-PkgUpdPatch
01:25 < mnemoc> over a submaster branch of my main submaster branch
01:25 < rxr> I seee
01:25 < rxr> I find this .msg files quite unintuitive
01:26 < mnemoc> it's a dump :\
01:26 < rxr> I would rather like to have debug in those files and the output in the form:
01:26 < rxr> sed-4.0.9
01:26 < rxr> withotu the random junk ...
01:26 < rxr> without even
01:26 < mnemoc> sometimes you can't sort the right 'last version'
01:27 < rxr> but my brain does not like parsing this junk ...
01:28 < mnemoc> sometimes i add [CV-DEL]s to .desc to minimize the junk ;)
01:29 < mnemoc> btw, we will need to add CV-URL to every package from sourceforge :(
01:30 < mnemoc> they 'download' servers don't share the file list anymore
01:30 < daja77> cv-dvelk?
01:31 < mnemoc> [CV-{URL,PAT,DEL}] are fields of .desc used by Check-PkgVersion
01:32 < daja77> ok new build started, off to bed now
01:33 < mnemoc> gn8 daja
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02:06 < rxr> imnbtw, another log variant allowed, is:
02:06 < rxr> * updated afterstep (2.00.beta3 -> 2.00.beta4b)
02:06 < snafu_> n8
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03:21 < nzg> n8
03:26 < rxr> n8
03:26  * rxr off, in some seconds, too
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10:01 < blindy> moin
10:03 < netrunner> hi blindy 
10:09 < blindy> hi netrunner 
10:18 < owl> moin
10:18 < owl> .oO(how to get a palm-zire working under linux?)
10:18 < blindy> moin owl
10:18 < blindy> owl: connect, press hotsync, use /dev/usb/tts/0
10:19 < owl> well, i did... and: with 2.6.6 /dev/usb/tts/0 isn't created
10:19 < blindy> do you have the necessary module loaded?
10:19 < owl> usbserial and visor
10:20 < blindy> hmm
10:20 < blindy> strange
10:20 < owl> jeps
10:20 < blindy> what does dmesg say?
10:21 < owl> drivers/usb/serial/usb-serial.c: USB Serial support registered for Handspring Visor / Palm OS
10:21 < owl> drivers/usb/serial/usb-serial.c: USB Serial support registered for Sony Clie 3.5
10:21 < owl> drivers/usb/serial/usb-serial.c: USB Serial support registered for Sony Clie 5.0
10:21 < owl> usbcore: registered new driver visor
10:21 < owl> drivers/usb/serial/visor.c: USB HandSpring Visor / Palm OS driver v2.1
10:21 < blindy> then it should be there
10:22 < owl> yep. _should_ (as i also read in the docu). but why isn't it there? bug? 
10:22 < blindy> no, it takes a few seconds until it is created
10:22 < owl> hmm. also after some minutes it's not created
10:24 < blindy> hmm
10:24 < blindy> strange
10:24 < owl> yeah. 
10:26 < owl> i will try my luck with 2.4.26 now... and i'm really "gespannt" if it will work
10:30 < owl> SQUEEEEEEK!
10:30 < owl> eye-cancer. 
10:31 < blindy> hm?
10:32 < owl> my bf booted his old winxp
10:43 < blindy> oh
10:50 < owl> yeah. and: the palm zire doesn't work with 2.4.26, too
10:50 < blindy> hmm
10:51 < owl> hm?
10:56  * netrunner thinks you're doing something wrong.
10:57 < owl> hm? and what?
10:57 < owl> (my bf is just using windows because he used it before we knew us - and wants to backup some data)
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11:06 < blindy> shabby excuses :P
11:08 < owl> nah :p
11:11 < dsoul> owl http://snovae.in2p3.fr/ycopin/soft/zire.html
11:15 < owl> thx. but -it should work with kernels > 2.4.20
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11:15 < dsoul> should :>
11:16 < owl> hrmpf. 
11:16 < owl> do you know that it doesn't?
11:23 < dsoul> i've heard about problems
11:24 < owl> hrmhrm. k. k and i just found the places where i should have to write the stuff down - already written there. -> not well
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12:06 < rxr> moin
12:08 < blindy> moin moin
12:10 < netrunne1> moin rxr
12:11 -!- netrunner [~andreas@pD9E8D39D.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)]
12:15 < owl> hi rxr 
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12:17 < dsoul> hi rxr 
12:20 -!- netrunne1 is now known as netrunner
12:20  * daja77 slaps netrunner
12:22  * netrunner ducks and kicks daja in his ...
12:23 < dsoul> :>
12:23 < daja77> your bootspalsh stuff is breaking the kernel packages ....
12:28  * blindy --> food
12:43 < blindy> back
12:44 < netrunner> daja77: how?
12:45 < daja77> seems that you use another diff for it for which there was no submaster patch
12:45 < blindy> http://www.heise.de/newsticker/meldung/48188 <-- IBM gets Patent on displaying the status of the Caps Lock key
12:45 < daja77> download/avm/bootsplash/bootsplash-3.0.7-2.4.22-vanilla.diff
12:46 < daja77> that's the one I have, and download fetches no newer one
12:46 < daja77> download/avm/bootspla
12:46 < daja77> sh/bootsplash-3.0.7-2.4.24-vanilla.diff
12:46 < daja77> that's the one it tries to apply
12:49 < netrunner> daja77: I wonder what version of the bootsplash patch you applied ...
12:50 < netrunner> daja77: it tries to apply a patch that fits the kernelversion, if it doesn't find one it takes one that is configured as backup patch.
12:51 < netrunner> daja77: my .desc downloads ..2.24-vanilla.diff and this is also the backup in the pkg_linux24_pre.conf
12:53 < daja77> could be a submaster merge error then >_<
12:54 < daja77> linux26 breaks differently
12:54 < daja77> could be uml related, though i haven't activated uml ...
12:55 < netrunner> daja77: oh, you trying my uml patch?
12:55 < daja77> I applied almost all patches from submaster, but I haven't selected uml in config
12:56 < netrunner> daja77: the uml patch is only applied when you activate it.
12:58 < netrunner> daja77: for some reason I cannot deselect the bootsplash patch here, do you have the same behaviour?
13:00 < daja77> can you make up something out of this http://lospalmos.homelinux.net/rock-errlogs/1-linux26.err
13:00 < daja77> yep can't deselect it
13:02 < netrunner> daja77: yes, you applied an already discarded version of uml patch, that exports ARCH=um even when deselected.
13:02 < daja77> >_<
13:05 < netrunner> daja77: you can edit package/base/uml_utilities/pkg_linux24_pre.conf and move the last fi to the bottom of the file
13:05 < daja77> anyway have to create a new clean submaster repo anyway, nice to know clifford does not really use it for himself
13:37 < netrunner> wow, map24.de has a cool java applet there ...
13:39 < owl> gah. i get insane by using linux && palm
13:45  * netrunner just found that he has a hostap package ... anybody wants some
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14:01 < daja77> owl: tried kpilot?
14:03 < owl> nope. i dont to try it, because i dont get /dev/usb/tts/0
14:03 < daja77> why
14:03 < owl> good question
14:05 < owl> it seems to register it, if i'm using the "hotsync" button and deregistering it, if the connection was closed... (or better timed out)... 
14:05 < daja77> yeah that's the wy it is supposed to be
14:06 < daja77> way
14:06 < daja77> so what is the problem
14:07 < owl> owl@ancoras:~/jpilot-0.99.7$ ls -l /dev/usb
14:07 < owl> insgesamt 0
14:07 < owl> ^^ this is the problem
14:07 < daja77> nope
14:07 < owl> not? O_o
14:07 < daja77> just press sync on the app you are using after pressing hotsync on the cradle
14:09 < owl> hrm. i thought it needs an serialport??? 
14:09 < nzg> moin
14:10 < owl> hi nzg 
14:10 < nzg> moin owl
14:10 < daja77> owl: is it a usb cradle or not?
14:10 < owl> yes, it is
14:11 < daja77> the device is only present during the hotsync period
14:11 < owl> yeah, but it isn't... 
14:12 < daja77> hoe do ypu know
14:13 < owl> if i'm doing ls -l /dev/usb/ then i don't see it, if i'm using jpilot... and jpilot says: "no such device or directory"
14:14 < daja77> after pressing hotsync?
14:14 < owl> yep
14:14 < daja77> what does dmesg say
14:15 < netrunner> daja77: scroll a bit back, she posted in the morning that it gets registered.
14:16 < daja77> k.
14:17 < netrunner> owl: you can try a `watch -n 1 ls -l /dev/usb`  and then press hotsync.
14:18 < owl> aehm. doesnt work (watch)
14:19 < blindy> watch --interval=1 "ls -l /dev/usb"
14:21 < owl> thx
14:21 < owl> pi_bind: No such file or directory
14:21 < owl> pi_bind Illegal seek
14:21 < owl> Check your serial port and settings
14:21 < owl> Exiting with status SYNC_ERROR_BIND
14:21 < owl> Finished
14:21 < owl> and: all the time: 
14:21 < owl> total 0
14:29 < owl> .oO(i'm glad that not just me has no clue why this crap happens) :(
14:34 < owl> <- off. bye
14:36 < netrunner> what is pottasche?
14:38 < tcr_> Asche aus'm (Ruhr)pott?
14:38 -!- tcr_ is now known as tcr
14:38 < netrunner> some ingredient for the honeycake I plan to bake now
14:38 < nzg> it's ashes from plants, and mostly contains potassium-oxide/hydroxide/carbonate
14:39 < nzg> you get it at the "reformhaus" maybe
14:39 < netrunner> so I can also use baking powerder for that.
14:39 < tcr> the german bundestag ?
14:39 < nzg> it was used to make soap in ancient times
14:39 < nzg> ;-) no tcr
14:40 < nzg> netrunner: yes, it should work, but i won't promise, you can try "Kaiser Natron" also, it should disintegrate to CO2 under heat too
14:41 < tcr> Is it baking or chemestry what you're doing?
14:41 < netrunner> nzg: the cake shall definitely not taste like sope afterwards :)
14:41 < netrunner> tcr: honeycake
14:41 < nzg> this is more similar to pottash, since  baking powder is based on potassium-carbonate but contains citric-acid
14:41 < netrunner> www.ruhr-uni-bochum.de/~schaelcz/ kochfreunde/weihnachten/3/3/1181.htm
14:42 < nzg> netrunner: therefore you must use a lot of pottash and give it in cooking oil
14:43 < nzg> when the oil starts to build the first blocks, you need to throw in some potassium chloride to get more soap...
14:43  * netrunner asking the stepgranma that lives below, she might have this fancy ashes 
14:45 < nzg> but don't use it to wash your car, it's not as good for your skin as you may believe
14:49 < nzg> s/car/skin
14:57 < netrunner> *rofl* http://bash.org/?338364
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14:59 < nzg> muhahaha
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16:28 < mnemoc> rehi
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16:33 < netrunner> hi mnemoc 
16:34 < netrunner> grmbl, the bootsplash patch for 2.6 does not apply any more :/
16:34 < mnemoc> hi netrunner 
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16:40 < netrunner> fascinating, a project on sf calls itself 5-production/stable and it's release is called 0.3Alpha2
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16:40 < nzg> hm, interesting ;-)
16:40 < nzg> did you get your pottash
16:41 < netrunner> no, used baking powder. it's in the oven now
16:48 < rxr> hi mnemoc 
16:48 < mnemoc> what are you cooking?
16:49 < netrunner> argl. 'your distribution could not be verified, $program will now exit'
16:50 -!- nookie [~nookie@M321P010.adsl.highway.telekom.at] has joined #rocklinux
16:50 < netrunner> mnemoc: honeycake
16:51  * netrunner 's cakes are famous here :)
16:51 < nzg> next time you can use "kaiser natron", it's also called baking soda and comes nearest to pottash
16:51 < mnemoc> sane dme a piece ;)
16:51  * nzg wants a pice
16:51 < mnemoc> send me even
16:51 < nzg> s/ic/iec
16:52 < netrunner> you all can join me at the party where I am supposed to deliver it. 
16:52 < netrunner> the village is called ROTT
16:52 < netrunner> :)
16:52 < nzg> depends on how far it is
16:53 < mnemoc> it's a bit far to me
16:54 < nzg> ;-)
16:55 < nzg> beaming would be a good idea ;-)
16:55 < netrunner> this stupid ignorant programmer uses german class names ..
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17:04 < netrunner> not that I wouldn't understand it, but it feels like reading french source ... it's just uncomfortable
17:06 < mnemoc> sadly computing was made to be written in english
17:06 < mnemoc> well... they have the most limited charset. that's good for compatibility 
17:09 < mnemoc> and the most limited language...
17:09 < mnemoc> .oO( dialect? )o
17:09 < netrunner> rfc: switch rocklinux to chineese, they have the moste complete charset :)
17:10 < mnemoc> :)
17:13 < rxr> mnemoc: noone forces you to use ASCII at all, just create a ASCII-less UTF16 only target ... 
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17:15 < mnemoc> i grow with a us keyboard.... i _can't_ use the other keys :\
17:19 < nzg> i once saw  german version of logo... that was really ugly
17:20 < nzg> "wenn a=b dann ... sonst"
17:20 < mnemoc> you see? it in our dna now
17:23 < nzg> yes, you get used to coding in english
17:23 < mnemoc> here, and i guess there too, new generations use UTF-8 chars as something natural. that's discusting
17:25 < nzg> you can't do anything against ;-)
17:25 < mnemoc> i know :(
17:38 < rxr> cu
17:39 < netrunner> it's not the getting used to code in english, more the thought 'how many would pay attention to me/my code' ;)
17:39 < nzg> i wouldn't say so, i use english closed source things i do too, although i'm obviously not native english
17:40 < nzg> cya rxr
17:40 < netrunner> c'ya rxr
17:40 < nzg> it's just you have english all around, the docs, the environment, the language
17:41 < netrunner> yeah, they're quite intrusive 
17:42 < nzg> it somehow switches your brain to some other mode
17:45  * netrunner going party
17:46 < nzg> have fun netrunner
17:46 < netrunner> damn, I need a dual Xeon for the intel build work :/
17:46  * netrunner putting his laptop on 4 cd cases for better ventilation
17:47 < nzg> yeah, would like some too
17:49 < nzg> btw, why takes it 1hour to build the kernel during Build-Target but only 10minutes if i do the job by hand?
17:51 < LowLander> ohhh cool IBM patent on caplock-status
17:52  * LowLander makes sure he goes to vote CSU tomorow, to make sure we can have patents like that in the EU too
17:54 < nzg> i don't go voting, since i'm to far away from home atm...
17:54 < mnemoc> nzg: rock builds every single module available, when you tune your kernel you don't
17:57 < mnemoc> we can't even vote that kind of stuff... we have 'agreements' which turn into law every law in many countries :\
17:57 < nzg> hm, that may be the reason
17:58 < nzg> i never thought that this makes so much build-time...
17:58 < mnemoc> glibc take more than that
17:59 < mnemoc> and all my cpu time
17:59 < LowLander> mnemoc, well thats what the EU elections (should be) for
18:00 < LowLander> atleast they kind of stopped the patent stuff in the first round
18:00 < LowLander> and if i look at holland the leftwing got stronger (greens etc. got more votes than last time)
18:00 < nzg> glibc took just half an hour...
18:01 < nzg> i use nice to prevent a build from sucking all my cpu-power
18:02 < mnemoc> good idea
18:04 < nzg> ;-) i'm not turend on by the idea of sitting in front of my box and watching the build being unable to do anything with it
18:14 < mnemoc> i don't build on my box ;)
18:21 < nzg> i just have this one, the other one is simply tooooooooooooooo slow
18:24 < nzg> cool, just seen little cobras on tv
18:25 < nzg> they look really pretty
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19:06 < nzg> re
19:06 < mnemoc> re nzg 
19:07 < nzg> thx mnemoc
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19:08 < nzg> 1.2GB are now on my disk
19:09 < nzg> i hope the rest is not too much more
19:12 < nzg> 140 MB or so to go
19:15 < nzg> this means i can start building in about 4 hours
19:15 < nzg> yeah ;-)
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21:39 < rxr> re
21:41 < dsoul> hi rxr 
21:47 < nzg> hi rxr
22:03 < rxr> yeah - hi
22:16 < daja77> re
22:18 < nzg> wb daja77
22:18 < daja77> thx
22:20 < nzg> daja77: most of the stuff i didn't need seems to have not changed since my last complete download some time ago
22:20 < nzg> so it wasn't downloaded
22:21 < daja77> :D
22:22 < nzg> and i'm almost finished ;-)
22:22 < nzg> i think it is somewhat arount 60 megs remaining
22:27 < mnemoc> rehi
22:29 < daja77> hi mnemoc 
22:30 < nzg> wb mnemoc
22:45 < mnemoc> hi
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23:25 < mnemoc> anyone knows the difference between .qmail and .qmail-default?
23:26  * mnemoc puzzled :\
23:43 < mnemoc> bingo! :)
23:44 < nzg> ?
23:48 < mnemoc> ignore me ;)
23:48 < nzg> k, if you like ;-)
--- Log closed Sun Jun 13 00:00:25 2004