[00:33] <daja77> O_o 5 errs in bootdisk
[00:38] <daja77> ah interesting bootdisk uses packages taht are not inj generic and thuis not download ;)
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[01:00] <mnemoc> oh
[02:04] Stormchaser (~w00t_w00t@BSN-77-102-212.dsl.siol.net) joined #rocklinux.
[02:04] <Stormchaser> hi!
[02:04] <Stormchaser> is there a release of rocklinux for AMD64?
[02:05] <_Ragnar_> sure, build your own :)
[02:05] <Stormchaser> how?
[02:05] <mnemoc> Stormchaser: www.rocklinux.org
[02:05] <mnemoc> ROCKLinux is a distribution build kit not a distribution
[02:05] <Stormchaser> something like gentoo?
[02:06] <mnemoc> no
[02:06] <mnemoc> gentoo is built on target machine during 'install time'
[02:06] <Stormchaser> hm
[02:06] <mnemoc> rock crossbuilds and generates iso files and binary packages of what you built
[02:07] Action: Stormchaser checks
[02:07] <Stormchaser> sounds VERY interesting :)
[02:08] <mnemoc> it is :)
[02:08] <_Ragnar_> yes :)
[02:08] <Stormchaser> lol
[02:09] <Stormchaser> um... What do I need to pull down? skeleton?
[02:10] <_Ragnar_> http://www.rocklinux.org/rock20down.html
[02:11] <_Ragnar_> you already have a host system where you can build on?
[02:12] <mnemoc> Stormchaser: check it out from subversion
[02:13] <Stormchaser> um
[02:14] <Stormchaser> this is more like LFS?
[02:14] <mnemoc> no
[02:14] <mnemoc> gentoo is like LFS
[02:14] <Stormchaser> I'm still trying to figure this out ;)
[02:14] <mnemoc> =)
[02:16] <Stormchaser> I have a semi-LFS system to build things, yeah...
[02:16] <Stormchaser> But it's too much clutered :/
[02:17] <mnemoc> rock does all the job for you
[02:17] <mnemoc> (except the configuration on the installed machine)
[02:17] <Stormchaser> configuration is simple :)
[02:18] <mnemoc> then rock is simple :)
[02:18] <mnemoc> and light
[02:18] <_Ragnar_> unless you do reference builds ;)
[02:18] <Stormchaser> Argh!
[02:19] <Stormchaser> stop confiusing me :)
[02:19] <_Ragnar_> ^_^ sorry
[02:19] <Stormchaser> lol
[02:19] <mnemoc> reference is a 'target' (distribution declaration) which builds almost everything, to help us to test
[02:19] <Stormchaser> It has a whole different concept than other linuxes
[02:20] <mnemoc> you don't want to build that
[02:20] <Stormchaser> mnemoc: multiplatform?
[02:20] <mnemoc> Stormchaser: yes
[02:20] <mnemoc> Rock cross-builds your target
[02:20] <Stormchaser> oh, that's nice
[02:21] <mnemoc> and it generate binary packages (like .rpm) which you can install or use to update any machine :)
[02:22] <Stormchaser> so um... It something like a build tool?
[02:22] <mnemoc> you can build in some hours a highly optimized linux for that old 486 on your sparc64 :D
[02:22] <mnemoc> build kit is the word we use
[02:23] <Stormchaser> interesting
[02:23] <Stormchaser> Very original concept ^.^
[02:23] <mnemoc> it is a set of tools, and a text/file based database, something like a framework
[02:23] <mnemoc> Stormchaser: rock is here since 1999 iirc
[02:24] <Stormchaser> I remember testing it once on vmware
[02:24] <Stormchaser> I got a boot disk from somewhere...
[02:24] <mnemoc> you might be tested a product of ROCKLinux, not ROCKLinux itself
[02:25] <mnemoc> the focus on the development is absolutly different
[02:25] <Stormchaser> so someone just made an ISO out of packages?
[02:27] <Stormchaser> um... Is the svn slow or is it just my connection? 
[02:29] <_Ragnar_> mnemoc: any idea about this:
[02:29] <_Ragnar_> ====[main_lx:1 (last $?=0)> make ARCH=i386 CROSS_COMPILE= KCC=kcc-34 -j 1 clean
[02:29] <_Ragnar_> xargs: environment is too large for exec
[02:29] <_Ragnar_> == 11/12/04 17:43:08 =[5]=> Aborted building package linux26.
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[02:36] <_Ragnar_> hmmm okay unset TERMCAP did the job ... but it's pretty weird
[02:36] <demian> hi
[02:36] <_Ragnar_> hi demian 
[02:36] <demian> Ragasaur.
[02:37] Action: _Ragnar_ wags tail
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[02:57] <Stormchaser> uhm
[02:57] <mnemoc> :\
[02:57] <Stormchaser> how do you choose not to download kernel 2.4 and rather just 2.6
[02:57] <Stormchaser> ?
[02:58] <_Ragnar_> there's a config option to use 2.4 or 2.6
[02:58] <mnemoc> set a Config with your desires
[02:58] <mnemoc> and ./scripts/Download -required
[02:58] <Stormchaser> I know
[02:58] <Stormchaser> hm
[02:59] <mnemoc> an option?
[02:59] <Stormchaser> but in Cofig there is no option to choose the kernel version
[03:00] <mnemoc> i remember an option to enable module-init-tools
[03:00] <_Ragnar_> huh?
[03:00] <mnemoc> Stormchaser: expert -> custom package selection
[03:00] <Stormchaser> ah :)
[03:01] <mnemoc> uhm... linux's config.in has changed more than a bit on trunk
[03:01] <_Ragnar_> ;)
[03:03] <mnemoc> _Ragnar_: :\
[03:03] <Stormchaser> what is the differencd between trunk and stable?
[03:04] <mnemoc> trunk is pointing to rock-3.x... many many many new features are getting in
[03:04] <_Ragnar_> trunk is the bleeding edge, but might contain bugs which prevent it from building cleanly
[03:05] <Stormchaser> o.O
[03:05] <Stormchaser> even the GCC 3.4 and KDE 3.3 and X.org?
[03:05] <mnemoc> those are on trunk
[03:06] <mnemoc> gnome28 too
[03:06] <Stormchaser> I'm getting trunk instead :)
[03:06] <Stormchaser> I was KDE devel some time back
[03:06] <Stormchaser> so... :)
[03:06] <mnemoc> Stormchaser: Crystal target is building flawless on trunk
[03:07] <mnemoc> it may have everything you want
[03:07] <Stormchaser> trunk is only avaliable trough SVN?
[03:07] <mnemoc> yes
[03:07] Action: Stormchaser needs to recompile svn for making this thing work
[03:07] <Stormchaser> I have version 0.27 :/
[03:07] <mnemoc> :p
[03:08] <mnemoc> don't forget neon to have http{,s}
[03:08] <Stormchaser> when I try to synch, it only collects architectures/arm and then stops ^.^
[03:09] <mnemoc> btw, iirc qt segfaults with gcc34 on sparc64 if that is your case
[03:09] <mnemoc> :\
[03:09] <Stormchaser> nah... AMD64 is my case :)
[03:10] Action: Stormchaser needs food
[03:12] Action: _Ragnar_ wants and AMD64, preferably SMP
[03:12] <_Ragnar_> an*
[03:15] <Stormchaser> SMP? Opteron :)
[03:15] <Stormchaser> I hace athlon 64
[03:16] <Stormchaser> er 
[03:16] <Stormchaser> have
[03:17] <_Ragnar_> it's athlon, it's 64 bit ... call it what you like :)
[03:17] <_Ragnar_> uhm AMD
[03:17] <mnemoc> =)
[03:17] <Stormchaser> lol
[03:21] <Stormchaser> not sure, if there are SMP motherboards for athlon 64
[03:22] <mnemoc> yes, there are
[03:22] <Stormchaser> for athlon 64?
[03:23] <mnemoc> yes
[03:23] <Stormchaser> never heard of that
[03:23] <Stormchaser> who is the manufacturer?
[03:23] <mnemoc> no idea, i just saw the machine and got impressed :)
[03:24] <Stormchaser> kewl :)
[03:24] <Stormchaser> I'll google around a bit :)
[03:27] <mnemoc> but i'm happy with a dual Xeon/HT
[03:27] <Stormchaser> xeon is pretty good :)
[03:28] <Stormchaser> there we go... Now it's downloading like insane :)
[03:28] <Stormchaser> why chose svn instead of cvs?
[03:28] <mnemoc> cvs stinks :)
[03:29] <Stormchaser> nah
[03:29] <Stormchaser> it's not that bad :)
[03:29] <mnemoc> no renames, no changesets
[03:29] <mnemoc> that's enough to drop it
[03:29] <Stormchaser> lol!
[03:29] <Stormchaser> The ONLY thing I missed in cvs is renaming
[03:29] <mnemoc> changesets are vital to be able to revert changes
[03:30] <Stormchaser> changesets?  You mean like diffs?
[03:30] <mnemoc> a bunch of changes to different files
[03:31] <Stormchaser> ah
[03:31] <mnemoc> if you add a package here you will add a dir and two files
[03:31] <mnemoc> that's a changeset
[03:32] <mnemoc> you revert it or merge it as a whole, not a three different (and untrackable) commits
[03:32] <Stormchaser> heh
[03:32] <Stormchaser> never missed that at CVS
[03:32] <Stormchaser> :)
[03:32] <Stormchaser> er
[03:32] <mnemoc> a commit to update .cache files involves 1200 files.... 1200 commits? :)
[03:32] <Stormchaser> nevver worried 
[03:33] <mnemoc> 1200 merges to branches?
[03:33] <mnemoc> that can hurt
[03:33] <Stormchaser> actually you can add a cvs add <dirname> and in that dir cvs add *
[03:33] <Stormchaser> :)
[03:34] <Stormchaser> in KDE are > than 1200 :)
[03:34] <mnemoc> but that will internally do one commit per file
[03:34] <Stormchaser> usually
[03:34] <Stormchaser> yes
[03:34] <mnemoc> you still have merge and revert problem
[03:35] <Stormchaser> what happends in svn, if 2 people sumit different things in same version?
[03:35] <mnemoc> the whole repo has the version, not the file
[03:36] <mnemoc> the first commit will pass the second will fail because it's outdated
[03:36] <Stormchaser> hm
[03:36] <Stormchaser> same with CVS
[03:37] <Stormchaser> whew! LOTS of files
[03:39] <Stormchaser> hm
[03:39] <Stormchaser> can rock be stuffed on an ARM-powered CPU? Like PocketPC or something?
[03:40] <mnemoc> rock is bash
[03:40] <mnemoc> and curl
[03:40] <mnemoc> it runs on any posix arch were you can have those
[03:40] <Stormchaser> kewl
[03:41] <mnemoc> no fat makefiles like on Gentoo :p
[03:41] <Stormchaser> I should be looking @ uclinux for that, no? :)
[03:41] <_Ragnar_> yeah
[03:42] <mnemoc> we have uclibc, but i nt sure if it works :p
[03:42] <_Ragnar_> http://www.cdatas.com/ <-- those look neat;)
[03:45] <mnemoc> i prefer x86 :) and elks i a great way to have linux on ia16
[03:45] <Stormchaser> I should begin to hate myself :)
[03:46] <Stormchaser> I just d/l ed svn of rock, and -- erased it :/
[03:46] <mnemoc> :D
[03:46] <Stormchaser> I rule, don't I? 
[03:46] <_Ragnar_> ;)
[03:46] <Stormchaser> lol
[03:46] <mnemoc> apropos rm -rf
[03:46] <mnemoc> on rock you should never do that, why use mount --bind a lot
[03:46] <mnemoc> use ./scripts/Cleanup instead
[03:47] <_Ragnar_> do you know any x86 based embedded 32 bit boards?
[03:47] <_Ragnar_> in a similar form factor?
[03:47] <Stormchaser> x86?
[03:48] <_Ragnar_> procs with intels architecture
[03:48] <mnemoc> i have seen some educational 8086 embedded boards, but i don't know where they got them
[03:49] <Stormchaser> http://www.mouser.com/products/?pcode=ST%2032-Bit%20Microcontrollers&pcodeNumber=51157
[03:49] <_Ragnar_> we already have 8086, but that's not really a horse to bet on in the future
[03:49] <mnemoc> you want embedded ia32?
[03:51] <_Ragnar_> yeah
[03:51] <mnemoc> that would be nice
[03:51] <Stormchaser> http://www.mouser.com/index.cfm?handler=displayproduct&lstdispproductid=426777&e_categoryid=250&e_pcodeid=51157 <-- $28560?!?
[03:51] <mnemoc> what are you doing on embeddeds?
[03:52] <mnemoc> *click*
[03:52] <_Ragnar_> www.texmate.com <-
[03:53] <_Ragnar_> that's 28.56$
[03:54] <mnemoc> you get short with an 8086 for monitors?
[03:55] <_Ragnar_> ?
[03:55] <_Ragnar_> our stuff does a lot more then just monitor
[03:55] <mnemoc> sorry :(
[03:56] <_Ragnar_> null problemo :)
[03:56] <_Ragnar_> brb, heading home
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[04:10] <Stormchaser> how do I use package selection rules?
[04:10] <mnemoc> X foo
[04:10] <mnemoc> that enables foo
[04:10] <mnemoc> - foo
[04:10] <mnemoc> removes it from the list
[04:10] <mnemoc> and O foo disables it
[04:11] <mnemoc> a disabled package can be enabled later
[04:11] <Stormchaser> I know, but problem is, that I need to make new selection rule, and whatever I write is error :/
[04:11] <mnemoc> pacakge selection works filtering config/$config/packages
[04:11] <mnemoc> what you wrote?
[04:11] <Stormchaser> um... KDE
[04:12] <Stormchaser> or xfree
[04:12] <mnemoc> select crystal as target and no pkgsel :p
[04:12] <Stormchaser> ouch
[04:12] <mnemoc> KDE and xfree are not packages
[04:12] <mnemoc> are not rules neither
[04:13] <Stormchaser> what are rules?
[04:13] <mnemoc> X kde
[04:13] <Stormchaser> dammit :/
[04:13] <Stormchaser> ok... I selected minimalistic + xfree
[04:14] <mnemoc> this is your first time on rock, try the easy path until you learn how it works :)   (humble suggestion)
[04:14] <mnemoc> what stages work, etc...
[04:14] <mnemoc> how*
[04:14] <Stormchaser> heh
[04:15] <Stormchaser> never goes that easy with me :)
[04:15] <mnemoc> :p
[04:15] <mnemoc> me neither :p
[04:16] <mnemoc> btw, i'm not sure if that template works
[04:16] <Stormchaser> that's why I spent muuuuuuuuuuuch too much time behind this computer...
[04:16] <Stormchaser> what template?
[04:16] <mnemoc> minimalistic + xfree
[04:16] <Stormchaser> er
[04:16] <Stormchaser> why not?
[04:17] <mnemoc> because it's old
[04:17] <Stormchaser> darn'
[04:17] <mnemoc> it says xfree and trunk has xorg :p
[04:17] <mnemoc> it _shall_ be old
[04:17] <Stormchaser> um
[04:17] <Stormchaser> so it's just a name problem?
[04:18] <mnemoc> no, name reflects it's age and unmaintainability
[04:18] <Stormchaser> heh
[04:19] <mnemoc> there are two groups here, the first write their own targets, and the second use desktop or crystal
[04:20] <Stormchaser> dammit... It started to download 2.4 kernel AGAIN :/
[04:20] <mnemoc> Download -required
[04:20] <Stormchaser> yes
[04:20] Action: Stormchaser checks
[04:21] <mnemoc> check config/default/packages
[04:21] <mnemoc> lines started by X are built
[04:21] <mnemoc> and downloaded
[04:22] <Stormchaser> X -----5---- 101.500 base linux=linux26 0000 / base/kernel DIETLIBC KERNEL CORE 0
[04:22] <Stormchaser> X 01-------- 101.500 base linux=linux26-header 0000 / base/kernel DIETLIBC KERNEL CORE 0
[04:22] <Stormchaser> X -----5---- 101.500 base linux=linux26-source 0000 / base/kernel DIETLIBC KERNEL CORE 0
[04:23] <Stormchaser> what gives?
[04:25] <mnemoc> no linux=linux24?
[04:25] <Stormchaser> no
[04:26] <mnemoc> weird
[04:26] <Stormchaser> yep
[04:26] <Stormchaser> which is the most configurable option?
[04:27] <mnemoc> uhm?
[04:27] <Stormchaser> for target distribution
[04:27] <Stormchaser> where you can select packages
[04:29] <Stormchaser> er
[04:30] <Stormchaser> If I build KDE, what is the path? /opt?
[04:30] <mnemoc> yes
[04:30] <mnemoc> opt/kde..
[04:30] <Stormchaser> yay!!! :)
[04:31] <Stormchaser> finnaly one of rare um... dostros who put them in /opt
[04:31] <Stormchaser> *distros
[04:31] <mnemoc> :D
[04:31] <mnemoc> we dnt' build distros, you are building one :)
[04:32] <mnemoc> target does package selection on config.in
[04:32] <Stormchaser> ARGH!!! :)
[04:32] <Stormchaser> I can't find option to select packages :/
[04:32] <mnemoc> doing things over packages file
[04:33] <mnemoc> pkgsel is used for customizing a target
[04:33] <mnemoc> target filters packages file inside config.in
[04:33] <Stormchaser> ah... ok :)
[04:35] <Stormchaser> where is pkgsel?
[04:35] <mnemoc> Config -> expert -> custom package selection -> edit
[04:36] <mnemoc> X kde    is a pkgsel rule
[04:36] <Stormchaser> does it grabs the necessary deps, too?
[04:37] <mnemoc> deps are your problem :)
[04:37] <Stormchaser> dammit :)
[04:37] <mnemoc> .cache files have a list of autodetected dependencies
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[04:38] <mnemoc> but package selection is your responsability as target maintainer
[04:38] <Stormchaser> Just found it...
[04:38] <Stormchaser> lol
[04:39] <Stormchaser> x in fron of the package name means, weither is it selected or not :/
[04:39] <Stormchaser> weird
[04:39] <mnemoc> btw, if you found a package which can be built without something adding some option you shall improve .conf to add that option if that dependency is not found
[04:40] <mnemoc> Stormchaser: X: enable  -: remove   O: disable
[04:40] <mnemoc> you can also use *s
[04:40] <Stormchaser> *'s?
[04:40] <Stormchaser> what do those do?
[04:40] <mnemoc> wildcats
[04:41] <Stormchaser> is there a package gtk2?
[04:42] <mnemoc> gtk+2# echo package/*/gtk+*
[04:42] <mnemoc> package/gnome14/gtk+12 package/gnome14/gtk+extra10 package/gnome2/gtk+
[04:42] <mnemoc> # grep '^\[V\]' package/*/gtk+/*.desc
[04:42] <mnemoc> [V] 2.4.7
[04:43] <Stormchaser> heh
[04:44] <mnemoc> you said you like the rough way :p
[04:44] <Stormchaser> I didn't meant that rough... At least not at 4:44 am :)
[04:44] <mnemoc> hehe
[04:46] <Stormchaser> quake2?!?
[04:47] <mnemoc> # grep '^\[T\]' package/*/quake*/*.desc
[04:47] <mnemoc> [T] The Shooter ...
[04:47] <mnemoc> [T] Orginal Quake2 CD required
[04:47] <mnemoc> [T] Copy CD's baseq2 to /usr/local/games/quake2/ or ~/.quake2/baseq2
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[04:48] <Stormchaser> darn
[04:48] <Stormchaser> any other neat games?
[04:49] <mnemoc> grep -l extra/game package/*/*/*.desc |  cut -d'/' -f 3 | wc -l
[04:50] <mnemoc> 71
[04:50] Action: Stormchaser DIGS!!! :)
[04:51] <mnemoc> rock is fun, isn't it? :)
[04:51] <Stormchaser> gentoo, HIDE!!! :)
[04:51] <mnemoc> gentoo is pimp :p
[04:51] <Stormchaser> lol
[04:53] <Stormchaser> wuftpd???
[04:53] <Stormchaser> I thought that was outated looong ago
[04:53] <mnemoc> # echo package/*/wu*
[04:53] <mnemoc> package/base/wu-ftpd
[04:53] <Stormchaser> yep
[04:55] <mnemoc> i use twoftpd =)
[04:55] <Stormchaser> I use vsftpd
[04:56] <mnemoc> there are persons how likes wuftpd :)
[04:56] <Stormchaser> I used to like it
[04:56] <Stormchaser> very simple to configure, but sadly very buggy and unsecure
[04:56] <mnemoc> people use bind :)
[04:57] <mnemoc> and they use it a lot
[04:57] <Stormchaser> I know
[04:57] <Stormchaser> who is clifford?
[04:59] <mnemoc> rock's owner
[04:59] <Stormchaser> oh
[04:59] <mnemoc> www.clifford.at
[05:02] <Stormchaser> kewl
[05:02] <Stormchaser> a computer superfreak :)
[05:02] <mnemoc> yeah
[05:03] <Stormchaser> um
[05:03] <mnemoc> http://www.clifford.at/bfcpu/bfcpu.html <--- look
[05:03] <Stormchaser> once you installed everything; can you install / remove too?
[05:03] <mnemoc> sure
[05:03] <mnemoc> this is not LFS
[05:03] <mnemoc> mine -r foo
[05:04] <mnemoc> mine -i foo.gem
[05:04] <Stormchaser> kewl
[05:04] <mnemoc> mine and Emerge-Pkg also protect /etc 
[05:06] <mnemoc> i'll go to rest some hours... have fun :D
[05:06] <Stormchaser> I should get some sleep, too
[05:07] <Stormchaser> nite!
[05:07] <mnemoc> gn8
[05:09] <Stormchaser> just
[05:09] <Stormchaser> one
[05:09] <Stormchaser> more
[05:09] <Stormchaser> thing
[05:09] <Stormchaser> um
[05:10] <Stormchaser> how do you select x.org rather than xfree?
[05:12] <mnemoc> mom
[05:12] <mnemoc> X xorg
[05:13] <mnemoc> but that will only enable xorg package
[05:13] <mnemoc> you also can
[05:13] <mnemoc> X x11
[05:13] <mnemoc> - xfree86*
[05:13] <Stormchaser> aha
[05:13] <Stormchaser> ah 
[05:13] <Stormchaser> ok
[05:13] <Stormchaser> cool :)
[05:13] <mnemoc> enable the whole repo and remove xfree*
[05:14] <Stormchaser> nope...
[05:14] <Stormchaser> um
[05:14] <mnemoc> nope what?
[05:15] <Stormchaser> the - xfree86 removes x.org configuration o.O
[05:15] <mnemoc> oh
[05:15] <mnemoc> X x11 and check Confg
[05:16] <mnemoc> i live in 2.0-stable.... i'm not aware of everything that happens on trunk
[05:16] <Stormchaser> oh :(
[05:16] <Stormchaser> um
[05:16] <Stormchaser> there is no grub here?
[05:16] <mnemoc> of course there is
[05:17] <mnemoc> on x86 repo
[05:18] <Stormchaser> the -lilo x grub just removes lilo :/
[05:19] <mnemoc> X
[05:44] <Stormchaser> n8
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[10:08] <treo> sali
[10:52] <tcr> Does anyone happen to know how I can mark the end of a page with LyX resp. LaTeX?
[10:53] <netrunne2> *rofl* (de) http://www.pcwelt.de/news/software/104785/index1.html
[10:53] <netrunne2> tcr: there's sth like flushpage
[10:54] <netrunne2> hey, why 2?
[10:54] Nick change: netrunne2 -> netrunner
[10:54] <tcr> My firefox renders that page crappy
[10:54] <netrunner> mine works fine (1.0). but the text makes only 30% of the window width :)
[10:55] <tcr> is ff 1.0 in rock stable?
[10:55] <netrunner> stable trunk yes. just read the commit msg
[10:55] <tcr> Is there some source tarball?
[10:56] <netrunner> [D] 3021424548 firefox-1.0-source.tar.bz2 http://ftp.mozilla.org/pub/mozilla.org/firefox/releases/1.0/source/
[10:56] <netrunner> or do you mean for stable trunk?
[10:56] <tcr> .conf didn't change?
[10:57] <netrunner> tcr: yes it did. remove --enable-typeaheadfind or so.
[11:00] <tcr> Btw. the LaTeX command is \newpage. (Incidentally I found out that the info page of latex contains a nice command reference. I couldn't find one on the web.)
[11:00] <tcr> I'm downloading 1.0 right now.
[11:02] <tcr> netrunner, Is there some page for that article specially formatted for printing?
[11:03] <netrunner> http://www.pcwelt.de/defaults/drucken.cfm?pid=34&pk=104785
[11:03] <netrunner> but opens your printer window :)
[11:05] <tcr> Heh, nice one.
[11:20] <dsoul> is this normal that mono didnt build in 2.0.3?
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[11:34] <holyolli> hi!
[12:10] <daja77> hi holyolli 
[12:10] <holyolli> hi daja77 :)
[12:16] Action: netrunner giving up with the server build.
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[15:07] <Stormchaser> hi
[15:07] <Stormchaser> Um... Need help
[15:09] <Stormchaser> Some package broke, and I don't know, where is the error file
[15:09] <daja77> build/$id/var/adm/logs
[15:09] <Stormchaser> ah, thanks :)
[15:12] <Stormchaser> bin-x86_64/dietlibc.a: could not read symbols: Archive has no index; run ranlib to add one
[15:12] <Stormchaser> collect2: ld returned 1 exit status
[15:12] <Stormchaser> hm
[15:12] <Stormchaser> do I need dietlibc?
[15:12] <mnemoc> only if you are building a bootdisk
[15:13] <daja77> bootdisk is broken here too
[15:13] <Stormchaser> Damn :/
[15:14] <mnemoc> if you install injecting packages into the harddrive you don't need bootdisk
[15:14] <mnemoc> if you want to install from network or cd you need it
[15:14] <Stormchaser> at this moment; I don't need it, then
[15:16] <Stormchaser> hm... How do I restart the compilation, if I removed a package?
[15:17] <mnemoc> Config -oldconfig
[15:17] <mnemoc> Build-Target
[15:17] <Stormchaser> ah :)
[15:17] <Stormchaser> thanks :)
[15:18] <mnemoc> you are welcome
[15:18] <Stormchaser> weird...
[15:18] <Stormchaser> It still breaks
[15:19] <mnemoc> how did you removed it?
[15:19] <mnemoc> what got broken? dietlibc or something due to dietlibc?
[15:19] <Stormchaser> just -dietglibc in the Config
[15:20] <mnemoc> - dietlibc
[15:20] <mnemoc> withour the g
[15:21] <Stormchaser> oops... sorry... I ment libc
[15:21] <Stormchaser> it looks like dietlibc itself is broken, removed it, and just won't go on :(
[15:21] <mnemoc> after Config -oldconfig check your config/$foo/packages with grep
[15:23] <mnemoc> if you want to start again do ./scripts/Cleanup -full build/$foo-blah
[15:23] <Stormchaser> hm
[15:23] <Stormchaser> that might be an option
[15:26] <Stormchaser> what is cyclades?
[15:30] <mnemoc> uhm?
[15:31] <mnemoc> what is cyclades?
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[15:39] <blindcoder> moin
[15:40] <mnemoc> moin blindcoder 
[15:42] Action: blindcoder back to Berlin :)
[15:42] <mnemoc> for living?
[15:43] <blindcoder> been to Munich for a SUN Training last week
[15:43] <mnemoc> aha
[15:44] <blindcoder> ok, washing machine is running, things are at their place... guess I'll take a bath now ^^
[15:45] <blindcoder> bye
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[17:01] <Stormchaser> Hm...
[17:01] <Stormchaser> I have a trouble compilinig linux-utils :(
[17:02] <mnemoc> o_O
[17:02] <Stormchaser> there looks like a bug in cyclades.h
[17:02] <mnemoc> amd64?
[17:02] <Stormchaser> yep
[17:03] <Stormchaser> can I paste error here?
[17:03] <mnemoc> query it to me
[17:03] <Stormchaser> ok
[17:14] <blindcoder> back
[17:14] <mnemoc> blindcoder: http://storm.homeunix.org:8080/misc/1-util-linux.err
[17:34] <blindcoder> mnemoc: which revision?
[17:35] <Stormchaser> that is for me
[17:35] <Stormchaser> trunk... yesterdays
[17:35] <blindcoder> hmm
[17:35] <Stormchaser> I found it, tho
[17:35] <blindcoder> I have no experience with 64bit arches
[17:36] <Stormchaser> The util-linux/sysutils/cytune.c isn't patched...
[17:36] <Stormchaser> needs this:
[17:36] <Stormchaser> diff -ur util-linux-2.12b/sys-utils/cytune.c util-linux-2.12b-adj/sys-utils/cytune.c
[17:36] <Stormchaser>  --- util-linux-2.12b/sys-utils/cytune.c 2002-03-09 00:04:30.000000000 +0100
[17:36] <Stormchaser>  +++ util-linux-2.12b-adj/sys-utils/cytune.c 2004-10-25 19:44:27.892943264 +0200
[17:36] <Stormchaser>  @@ -58,6 +58,7 @@
[17:36] <Stormchaser>  #include <linux/tqueue.h>      /* required for old kernels (for struct tq_struct) */
[17:36] <Stormchaser>                                 /* compilation errors on other kernels */
[17:36] <blindcoder> Stormchaser: but you might want to check http://marc.free.net.ph/message/20041026.063036.d8f187a8.html
[17:36] <Stormchaser>  #endif
[17:36] <Stormchaser> +#include <linux/compiler.h>
[17:36] <Stormchaser>  #include <linux/cyclades.h>
[17:37] <Stormchaser>  
[17:37] <Stormchaser>  #if 0
[17:37] <Stormchaser> I know
[17:37] <Stormchaser> I just patched it...
[17:37] <blindcoder> so, create a diff and submit it to SubMaster for inclusion :-)
[17:37] <Stormchaser> oki :)
[17:38] Action: blindcoder continues eating his wahos :)
[17:40] <daja77> wahos?
[17:40] <blindcoder> waffles :) I just deflorated the waffle-iron I bought yesterday :)
[17:40] <Stormchaser> lol
[17:47] <Stormchaser> er
[17:47] <Stormchaser> SubMaster via email?
[17:48] <th> no. via webinterface
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[18:17] <Aard> moin
[18:18] <blindcoder> moin Aard 
[18:26] <Aard> I stumbled over problems rene had with 2.6.9-pre-kernels on sun -- symbios scsi driver, permanently printing stuff like `sym0:0:0:phase change 6-7 11@c3ff5390 resid=6.'. got it with 2.6.9 and 2.6.10-rc1. anyone knows more about this one?
[18:28] <blindcoder>  no linux on sun here, sorry
[18:28] <Aard> yeah, rene is not here either...
[18:29] <blindcoder> I doubt you'll find hem _here_ anytime soon
[18:30] <Aard> :)
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[18:33] <blindcoder> Stormchaser: meep
[18:33] <blindcoder> Stormchaser: please try here: https://www.rocklinux.net/submaster/smadm.cgi
[18:33] <Stormchaser> lol
[18:33] <Stormchaser> I sent the patch the wrong way, didn't I? :)
[18:34] <blindcoder> yes :(
[18:34] <Stormchaser> sorry
[18:36] <Stormchaser> hm
[18:36] <Stormchaser> What is sm patch? diff isn't goof?
[18:36] <blindcoder> sm is a CLI frontend to submaster
[18:37] <blindcoder> to create useful diffs use ./scripts/Create-Diff
[18:37] <blindcoder> and change the first line in the output to a short description of the patch
[18:37] <blindcoder> personally, I use a small shell script which uploads patches to SubMaster via curl
[18:37] <blindcoder> never used the sm CLI
[18:38] <Stormchaser> why diff isn't good?
[18:38] <blindcoder> Create-Diff actually does a diff against another tree
[18:39] <blindcoder> and does some magic on the output file so that a unified diff which can be applied to the rock-linux tree with -p1
[18:39] <blindcoder> that's basically all the patch has to be able to
[18:39] <blindcoder> so if you want to do it the hard way, use diff manually
[18:39] <blindcoder> if you want to make your life easy, use Create-Diff ;)
[18:39] <Stormchaser> heh... I did used diff :)
[18:40] <blindcoder> Stormchaser: actually, what you want to do is this:
[18:40] <blindcoder> the file you sent to the mailing list
[18:41] <blindcoder> put it into package/base/util-linux/ with a filename ending in .patch
[18:41] <blindcoder> then you make a diff against a vanilla rock tree like this:
[18:41] <blindcoder> ./scripts/Create-Diff /usr/src/rock-orig /usr/src/rock-mine package/base/util-linux
[18:42] <blindcoder> ./scripts/Create-Diff /usr/src/rock-orig /usr/src/rock-mine package/base/util-linux >20041113_util_linux.patch
[18:42] <blindcoder> and then upload 20041113_util_linux.patch to the SubMaster webfrontend
[18:42] <Stormchaser> ah... ok
[18:42] <blindcoder> sounds horribly complicated
[18:42] <blindcoder> but is really easy
[18:42] <Stormchaser> nope
[18:42] <blindcoder> if you want I can give you the shell-script I use
[18:42] <Stormchaser> nah
[18:42] <blindcoder> well, shell-function actually ):
[18:42] <blindcoder> :)
[18:55] <Stormchaser> hey... What gives?
[18:56] <Stormchaser> ./scripts/Create-Diff src.util-linux.1100350368.13437.2897569264/ src.util-linux.1100361300.7284.925649683/ <-- gives me a buch of errors :/
[18:56] <blindcoder> as to be expected
[18:56] <Stormchaser> what is wrong?
[18:56] <blindcoder> Create-Diff is used to create a diff between two ROCK trees
[18:56] <Stormchaser> o.O
[18:56] <blindcoder> not two temporary build-environments
[18:57] <blindcoder> the src.* directories/symlinks are just temporary build-environments that are chrooted into to build a given package
[18:58] <Stormchaser> I should re-download everything?
[18:58] <blindcoder> uhm, no. why?
[18:58] <blindcoder> or rather...
[18:58] <blindcoder> well, yes
[18:58] Action: Stormchaser sobs
[18:59] <blindcoder> but only the subversion checkout
[18:59] <blindcoder> you can also just copy the relevant directories to a second ROCK tree
[18:59] <blindcoder> usually I do something like this:
[18:59] <blindcoder> svn co svn://www.rocklinux.net/rock-linux/trunk rock-2.1-clifford
[18:59] <blindcoder> cp -r rock-2.1-clifford rock-2.1-bc
[19:00] <blindcoder> when I need a fresh environment
[19:00] <Stormchaser> hmhmhmhm
[19:01] <Stormchaser> em
[19:02] <Stormchaser> once, whenthe build is finished; how do I make it boot?
[19:02] <blindcoder> boot? or install on another machine?
[19:02] <Stormchaser> boot
[19:03] <blindcoder> well, copy it to a fresh partition/harddisk, mount devfs and proc, chroot into it and start stone
[19:03] <blindcoder> and setup your system like you usually would
[19:04] <Stormchaser> hm
[19:06] <Stormchaser> something tells me, that this will not be as easy as it sounds
[19:06] <blindcoder> well, it's quite easy on 32bit systems
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[22:00] <netrunner> any native english (or expert) here?
[22:00] <blindcoder> define expert
[22:00] <netrunner> as in 'knows the word I am looking for'
[22:01] <blindcoder> what _are_ you looking for?
[22:01] <netrunner> oh :)
[22:02] <netrunner> given a scheme that describes certain aspects of a thing. now you take several instances of this thing and describe them following the structure of the scheme. how is that called.
[22:02] <blindcoder> you know...
[22:02] <blindcoder> I have _absolutely_ no idea what you're talking about.
[22:03] <blindcoder> I'd call it policy
[22:03] <blindcoder> I think...
[22:03] <netrunner> I am looking for a verb.
[22:03] <blindcoder> I don't think there is one
[22:04] <netrunner> I don't even know how I would say it in german. there must be a word.
[22:04] <netrunner> I should invent a new.
[22:04] <blindcoder> heh
[22:05] <netrunner> it's not really classification. but somewhere in that direction.
[22:18] <Stormchaser> netrunner: construct?
[22:19] <netrunner> hm, no, I describe things that already exist.
[22:20] <netrunner> the important aspect is that I created this scheme, and now like squeezed all the other things into this scheme and described them accordingly.
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[23:09] <treo> gn8
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[00:00] --- Sun Nov 14 2004