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[00:18] <fake> netrunner: ntfsprogs has some very useful ntfs fixing utilities, independent of the kernel ntfs support
[00:18] <fake> and, hello, by the way
[00:18] <fake> i'm back ... *wee*
[00:20] <fake> ??????BBBBBBBBBBBV||||
[00:21] <fake> oops
[00:21] <fake> sorry - the cat
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[01:47] <mnemoc> rehi
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[08:37] <blindcoder> moin
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[09:16] <netrunner> moin, 2
[09:16] <netrunner> hehehe Keepnick: Nickstealer left [freenode], got netrunner back
[09:16] <blindcoder> netrunner: finally got it running, hm?
[09:16] <netrunner> for freenode obviously. let's check undernet ...
[09:17] <netrunner> hm.. he's not identifying me when I am not loosing my nick.
[09:19] <blindcoder> he should id you in case NickServ asks for identification
[09:19] <blindcoder> if nickserv asks then the regex in keepnick.pl might have to be adapted
[09:20] <netrunner> nobody asks there. the point is I can hide my ip by authenticating there. so I am not kicked in some channels
[09:20] <netrunner> blindcoder: what gpsd did you package for gpsdrive?
[09:20] <blindcoder> that's bad
[09:20] <blindcoder> netrunner: gpsdrive comes with a gpsd, no?
[09:21] <netrunner> ah ic
[09:21] <blindcoder> gpsdrive: usr/bin/gpsd
[09:22] <blindcoder> netrunner: the ROCK Sonar is still active and maintained at scavenger.homeip.net :-)
[09:23] <netrunner> blindcoder: I usually have a generic installed somewhere :)
[09:23] <blindcoder> okay
[09:26] <blindcoder> kerneltraffic seems damn slow today
[09:29] <netrunner> do you think it gets better when you mention it in an irc channel that instantly spawns at least 10 new connections to that server? :)
[09:29] <blindcoder> yeah, maybe the server finally wakes up to do its job that way :)
[10:22] <praenti> moin
[10:23] <praenti> keepnick?
[10:24] <praenti> what's that especially? how can i use this?
[10:38] <blindcoder> praenti: it's an irssi script
[10:39] <blindcoder> praenti: it autoid's you with nickserv and ghosts nickstealer/hanging connections
[10:41] <blindcoder> in short: it tries everyithing to get your nick back :)
[10:42] <praenti> ahh. thats cool
[10:44] <blindcoder> praenti: dcc send in progress
[10:45] <praenti> thx
[10:48] <blindcoder> praenti: /keepnick_help for instructions
[10:48] <praenti> ok
[12:43] <mnemoc> moin
[12:49] <praenti> moin mnemoc 
[12:50] <mnemoc> moin pra	
[12:53] <blindcoder> moin mnemoc 
[12:54] <mnemoc> hi blindcoder
[12:54] <mnemoc> blindcoder: will sonar get rl.net someday?
[12:55] <blindcoder> mnemoc: I could ask for it to be included there once again, yes
[12:56] <blindcoder> last time I asked there was no big response
[12:56] <blindcoder> http://www.rocklinux.net/lurker/message/20040425.184036.53877764.html
[12:57] <praenti> perhaps our header problems with 2.6 kernel are resolved in a few minutes
[12:57] <praenti> :-)
[12:58] Action: praenti had a good idea today morning
[13:00] Action: blindcoder ph34rs praentis good ideas...
[13:00] <praenti> argl. looks like there is a small error in...
[13:00] <praenti> blindcoder: why?
[13:01] Action: daja77 enjoying the holiday with learning ...
[13:01] <mnemoc> praenti is dangerous
[13:01] <mnemoc> hi daja77 
[13:01] <daja77> hi mnemoc 
[13:01] <praenti> and another one... i should only sanitize the headers when then package is in header mode
[13:02] <daja77> hehe
[13:02] <daja77> bl
[13:02] <praenti> ohh. i do that already... hmm
[13:02] <daja77> bbl
[13:03] <mnemoc> which is the file with the list of countries?
[13:03] <praenti> can anybody tell me how i can easily check if a directory is empty before running a for loop
[13:04] <praenti> otherwise I'm dangerous :-)))
[13:04] <blindcoder> praenti: -e $dir/* -o -e $dir/.[^.]*
[13:05] <mnemoc> blindcoder: does that work?
[13:05] <blindcoder> mnemoc: no idea :)
[13:05] <blindcoder> mnemoc: just came to mind quickly
[13:05] <mnemoc> at least ROCK-2.0 has always used "$dir/*" == "$( echo $dir/* )"
[13:07] <blindcoder> no, doesn't work
[13:08] <praenti> mnemoc: how do this work? 
[13:08] <praenti> shitt
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[13:08] <mnemoc> praenti: it compares the expansion of $dir/* with a failed expansion of $dir/* :p
[13:09] <praenti> hmm. i try that
[13:10] <mnemoc> blindcoder: your answer about amd64 patches was far more complete than mine :(
[13:10] <blindcoder> mnemoc: :)
[13:10] <blindcoder> mnemoc: I tried to make a complete howto for usage on the rl.org site
[13:10] <praenti> :-).
[13:11] <blindcoder> and I'm making it visible right... now :)
[13:12] <blindcoder> should be on the static page in a few minutes
[13:14] <praenti> see it :-)
[13:14] <praenti> but not onth rl.org but on the rl.net/typo3
[13:15] Action: mnemoc always wanted an account there :'(
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[13:19] Nick change: kasc_ -> kasc
[13:20] <blindcoder> mnemoc: just ask clifford in a private mail. I'm sure he won't have an issue with that
[13:21] <mnemoc> :)
[13:25] <praenti> btw. what files i need to delete to resolve my shared files?
[13:26] <praenti> i get shared files in the header because of a previous try: linux26-header linux26-san-header
[13:26] <praenti> but deleted var/adm/flists/linux26-san* already...
[13:27] <praenti> because this makes a little bit confused at the moment... (normally this ahs resolved such issues)
[13:29] <blindcoder> praenti: you also need to remove flists/linux26-header*
[13:29] <blindcoder> the old flist is added to the new
[13:29] <blindcoder> I had the weirdest errors because of that
[13:29] <praenti> ahh
[13:30] <praenti> right. thought i have done that already...+
[13:30] <praenti> blindcoder: btw. i seen that the documentation menu has a lot of link on rocklinux-consulting.de. I think we must change that also (if you have tim)
[13:33] <praenti> otherwise some other must do that.
[13:34] <blindcoder> yeah, I'll look into that
[13:34] <owl> moin
[13:34] <praenti> why the hell is mozilla showing me rocklinux.org and nothing looks like a on this address...
[13:34] <praenti> ahh.
[13:34] <praenti>   Browse the Sourcecode
[13:35] <praenti> and  Documentation Dir.
[13:35] <blindcoder> moin owl
[13:35] <praenti> has some kind of redirection
[13:35] <blindcoder> do we have a version of the handboox outside of rene's svn?
[13:36] <blindcoder> otherwise I'd temporarily deactivate that button
[13:37] <blindcoder> okay, browse the source and documentation dir fixed
[13:40] <blindcoder> Handbook page has been "deactivated"
[13:42] <praenti> blindcoder: would do the same. I know no version outside that
[13:43] <praenti> shit. my patch takes a little bit more time... :-(
[13:44] <praenti> need to add a sanitation patch with it to create the directory
[13:49] <praenti> where the hell gets the paranoia check the linux26-san-header package
[14:07] Action: blindcoder removing more "send to rene rebe" from the website
[14:09] <mnemoc> blindcoder: i think you can checkout the revision before the fork and fork it 
[14:11] <blindcoder> yeah, I guess that's a good idea
[14:11] <praenti> and who continue writing this handbook? only a question *now you can hurt me...*
[14:12] Action: blindcoder hurts praenti 
[14:12] <blindcoder> before continuing it it should first be sanitized
[14:13] <mnemoc> ROCK's needs the handbook, someday someone will continue it
[14:13] <mnemoc> s/'s//
[14:14] <blindcoder> hmm
[14:14] <blindcoder> v0.1.5 still contains ROCK so I think that's the most recent version
[14:15] <blindcoder> problem is: I have no idea about tex
[14:16] <mnemoc> tex is easy to learn
[14:16] Action: praenti cries ouch....
[14:16] <mnemoc> blindcoder: why using a release if you branch out the repository just before rene s/ROCK /T2/g ?
[14:17] <mnemoc> ... if you _can_ branch ...
[14:17] <blindcoder> mnemoc: because 0.1.5 is exactly that :-)
[14:18] <mnemoc> you will loose history
[14:18] <blindcoder> well, I guess I can't do a dump from a remote subversion server, can I?
[14:20] <blindcoder> hmm
[14:20] <blindcoder> guess I could write a script for that
[14:41] <fake> moin
[14:43] <mnemoc> moin fake 
[14:44] <blindcoder> moin fake 
[14:48] <blindcoder> almost done :)
[14:48] <mnemoc> blindy, the new maintainer of ROCK's Handbook :p
[14:49] <blindcoder> mnemoc: nah, almost done with writing a script to steal^Wbranch a remote svn-tree into a local one including all revisions with their history
[14:50] <mnemoc> =)
[14:50] <blindcoder> so I could for example branch the complete rocklinux tree preserving history if clifford doesn't want to give me a dump of the repository :)
[14:50] <mnemoc> that sounds like a nice project..... svn2svn, cvs2svn, .... :)
[14:52] <blindcoder> it isn't an exact copy of course
[14:52] <blindcoder> you loose the information on who committed which changes
[14:52] <blindcoder> (at least you will in V0.0.1 :-) )
[14:53] <blindcoder> I just got an idea on how you could even preserve that data :D
[14:55] <owl> hi fake 
[14:56] <fake> blindcoder: svm ? svn mirror
[15:02] <blindcoder> root@crazyhorse:/home/svn# svn mirror
[15:02] <blindcoder> Unknown command: 'mirror'
[15:05] <fake> svm is an external tool
[15:06] <fake> ... iirc
[15:07] <praenti> blindcoder: can you check if submaster does s.th. strange at the moment?
[15:07] <praenti> an sm get results in a html-output.
[15:08] <fake> http://search.cpan.org/~clkao/SVN-Mirror/bin/svm
[15:08] <praenti> hi fake 
[15:11] <blindcoder> hmm, doesn't look like it is what I am searching for, but I'll give it a try
[15:11] <netrunner> cool, my crystal pentium-m is ready
[15:13] <fake> netrunner: i'm very interested in that
[15:18] <netrunner> fake: 5-dhcp failed, which is a bit sad :/
[15:18] <blindcoder> done :D
[15:18] <blindcoder> svn2svn shell script finished ^^
[15:19] <netrunner> In file included from raw.c:53:
[15:19] <netrunner> /ROCK/src.dhcp.1100689097.5845.4067588644/dhcp-3.0.1/includes/dhcpd.h:309: error
[15:19] <netrunner> : mode `byte' applied to inappropriate type
[15:19] <netrunner> is that a known error?
[15:19] <blindcoder> never heard of it
[15:31] <netrunner> http://gcc.gnu.org/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=18282
[15:36] <praenti> ok. patch is finished. so now i try apmd
[15:39] <praenti> i hate this crppy package
[15:39] <praenti> uses gcc -I /usr/src/linux ...
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[15:40] <netrunner> praenti: what did you patch?
[15:41] <praenti> netrunner: patches some kernel build scripts to generate also sanitized headers which resides in /usr/include/{asm, asm-generic, linux}
[15:41] <praenti> but this is useless if packages uses the kernelheaders from /usr/src/linux which I personally donÄt want to patch...
[15:45] <praenti> ok. last try after patching also the makefile
[15:46] <fake> kernel build scripts? /usr/include/{asm, asdm-generic, linux} are installed by default, you just have to patch the header files in the linux packages
[15:47] <praenti> fake: we have the build part linuxxx-header
[15:47] <praenti> these headers are copied to /usr/include/{asm, asdm-generic, linux}
[15:48] <praenti> so on this location i have sanitized headers for user-space applications there
[15:48] <fake> yes.
[15:48] <praenti> headers in /usr/src/linux/include should not be patched because they are kernel headers and this headers should not be used by user-space applications
[15:48] <fake> oh boy
[15:49] <fake> append "in a perfect world" to that sentence and i agree
[15:49] <praenti> fake: :-)
[15:49] <praenti> and apmd has worked still at the moment :-)
[15:50] <fake> if no app should use kernel headers, and the kernel brings it own along, why are they installed in /usr/include anyways?
[15:52] <blindcoder> fake: because apps _do_ use kernel headers
[15:52] <praenti> yes, thats the point
[15:53] <blindcoder> actually I don't really understand why apps shouldn't use kernel headers in the first place
[15:53] <praenti> but headers which are lying in /usr/include are usable by user-space programs
[15:53] <praenti> headers in /usr/src/linux are not intended for compiling packages. you there are linux systems whithout kernel-sources
[15:54] <praenti> because of that /usr/include (yes there are also the complete needed C headers from glibc) is a satndard include location for the compiler and /usr/src/linux not
[15:55] <praenti> netrunner: see 2004111715331413165 and 2004111715515514092
[15:56] <blindcoder> ah, okay
[15:56] Action: praenti is sometimes very finicking
[15:56] Action: blindcoder has /usr/include/{linux,asm,asm-generic} as symlinks to /usr/src/linux/somewhere :/
[15:57] <owl> why this, blindcoder ?
[15:57] <blindcoder> because i once removed my old linux24-header package and suddenly I couldn't even do make menuconfig anymore
[15:57] <praenti> blindcoder: this was most of the time done in 2.4 time. Because the kernel headers worked there also for user-space applications
[15:58] <praenti> the 2.6 time is let me say a little bit fussy
[15:59] <praenti> and fuzzy :-)
[15:59] Action: praenti needs to get a shower
[15:59] <owl> blindcoder: well, this is very bad then. but why removing 2.4-kernel-package? i thought it's recommened to have the headers being in /usr/include/blubb... 
[15:59] <blindcoder> owl: yes, but I wanted to update to 2.6 so I removed all the things that were "left over" from 2.4
[16:00] <owl> and where's the problem with 2.6-kernel + 2.4-includes etc.?
[16:01] <blindcoder> I was young and stupid :)
[16:01] <owl> haha ;p
[16:01] <praenti> owl: no its not recommended. you cannot use the kernelinterfaces from 2.6 kernel. it is only recommended because kernel developers are reluctant to give us user-space working headers
[16:01] <blindcoder> praenti: how did they screw them up, anyway? something like
[16:01] <blindcoder> #ifdef userspace
[16:02] <blindcoder> __screw_up
[16:02] <blindcoder> #endif
[16:02] <blindcoder> or what?
[16:02] <owl> hmm. well, i just read it ... 
[16:02] <praenti> #ifdef __KERNEL__
[16:02] <praenti> so userspace has not defined things which are needed on some places
[16:03] <blindcoder> #define __KERNEL
[16:03] <blindcoder> #include
[16:03] <blindcoder> #undef __KERNEL__
[16:03] <blindcoder> :)
[16:03] <praenti> :-)
[16:04] <praenti> but now i will take a shower. cu
[16:04] <blindcoder> bye
[16:05] <praenti> ahh. some state to your idea __KERNEL__. spinlock.h doesn't work for example.
[16:05] <praenti> s/state/statement
[16:05] <praenti> even you do such a define
[16:05] <praenti> ...
[16:05] <blindcoder> bah, crap :)
[16:06] <praenti> but now time for the shower
[16:06] <blindcoder> okay, my svn2svn script just survived the crucial test: importing the t2-handbook repository :)
[16:25] <netrunner> blindcoder: I don't think we can use that.
[16:27] <blindcoder> netrunner: no, because most is 2.0-information
[16:27] <netrunner> blindcoder: I mean because of the copyright.
[16:27] <blindcoder> not that much has changed since I last had a look at T2 two weeks ago
[16:28] <blindcoder> I've looked at the license which basically states that we can't print (via Dead-Tree-Protocol) or sell it without rene's written authorisation
[16:30] <blindcoder> netrunner: or would you rather start over from scratch?
[16:30] <netrunner> yes.
[16:30] <blindcoder> hmm
[16:30] <blindcoder> maybe that's not such a bad idea
[16:30] <netrunner> it's stupid when we have no right on it.
[16:30] <netrunner> and we should give the copyright to the project.
[16:31] <blindcoder> I've had a co-worker of me reading the handbook and then complaining that there is too much for developers and almost nothnig for end-users
[16:31] <blindcoder> yeah, that's a good idea
[16:31] <blindcoder> anyway, /me going home now
[16:31] <blindcoder> I'll be back in 30-45 minutes
[16:31] <owl> bye blindy
[17:10] <blindcoder> back
[17:12] <blindcoder> netrunner: okay, deleted the old thing :)
[17:25] <daja77> .oO (nice can't login in freshly installed crystal)
[17:25] <daja77> next try ...
[17:31] <daja77> it claims it can't find libpam which is installed O_o
[17:36] <blindcoder> daja77: maybe libpam lacks something
[17:40] <daja77> login is linked against libpam.so.0 which isn't there but libpam.so.0.77 :/
[17:41] <daja77> trying again
[17:44] <fake> hi daja!
[17:50] <fake> hm
[17:50] <fake> somethings utterly wrong with the mgadrivers
[17:50] <fake> checksum-wise
[17:51] <fake> i changed/updated the checksum in the desc file
[17:52] <daja77> hi fake, greetings from repaired crystal install ;)
[17:53] Action: fake puzzled
[17:53] <daja77> <- crashed his rock 2.0.0beta6 severly ;)
[17:53] <fake> the damn checksumscripts/Download reports a the erroneous one doesn't occur under packages/, despite some .svn-base
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[17:56] <thefinn> hey anyone home?
[17:57] <thefinn> i just downloaded 2.0.6 and i'm wondering where to start ? what do i run first to bring up the dialogs ?
[17:57] <fake> hi
[17:57] <thefinn> heyya
[17:57] <blindcoder> we have no .0.6
[17:57] <fake> 2.0.6 is not yet released
[17:58] <thefinn> sorry 2.0.3
[17:58] <fake> read Documentation/*
[17:58] <thefinn> i wish to create my own ISO
[17:58] <daja77> scripts/Config
[17:58] <thefinn> yeah i did Config, it doesn't work very well :\
[17:58] <daja77> hm?
[17:59] <thefinn> well i'm assuming it's like the kernel config dialog ?
[17:59] <thefinn> in normal linux's
[17:59] <daja77> it is like that
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[17:59] <thefinn> well it's not very good
[18:00] <thefinn> if i choose something, it just hangs
[18:00] <thefinn> and it kind of just stops the whole program
[18:00] <thefinn> or is it thinking ?
[18:01] <thefinn> ah nevermind, it's thinking
[18:01] <thefinn> heh
[18:02] <thefinn> thankyou
[18:05] <daja77> hm why is there a compiler runnig when creating linux26-src package 
[18:05] <fake> because of scripts/makedep and stuff
[18:07] <thefinn> ok this is kinda neat
[18:08] <thefinn> is there documentation for adding your own packages ? :)
[18:08] <thefinn> like... i'd like to run openview instead of the larger window managers
[18:16] <thefinn> not possible ?
[18:17] <fake> why not?
[18:18] <thefinn> i can't work out how to add/remove packages..
[18:18] <thefinn> i'm in the build config menu with the packages all listed
[18:18] <thefinn>   x x   ===>  Realtime Options                                            x x  
[18:18] <thefinn>   x x   ===>  POV Ray 3.1x Options                                        x x  
[18:18] <thefinn>   x x   ===>  GNOME 1.4 Package Options                                   x x  
[18:18] <thefinn>   x x   ===>  Gtk+1.2 Package Options                                     x x  
[18:18] <thefinn> etc..
[18:18] <fake> that's a bit uncomfortable, yes.
[18:18] <thefinn> ok..
[18:18] <fake> there is the 'use manual package selection'
[18:19] <fake> there you can specify regular expressions to select packages
[18:19] <thefinn> oh ok i haven't found that.. i'll look
[18:19] <thefinn> omg... regexp? :)
[18:20] <fake> you can just write package names, too, of course ;)
[18:20] <thefinn> well.. so far this is painfully slow...
[18:21] <thefinn> every time i choose an option it takes about 45 seconds
[18:21] <fake> yes, the config menu is very cpu intensive, because it re-evaluates a lot of scripts every time a value changes.
[18:29] <thefinn> well i might be mistaken but the menu doesn't allow for you to remove packages from the install you're creating, so how do i do this ?
[18:30] <fake> it does, X, O...
[18:30] <fake> some packages can't be removed
[18:31] <fake> you may want to have a look at misc/pkgsel/*
[18:31] <fake> it's a way more comfortable way of creating package selections
[18:31] <thefinn> ok
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[18:52] <treo> sali
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[19:44] <owl> re
[19:47] <blindcoder> wb
[19:48] <owl> thx
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[20:18] <netrunner> hm. I think I have fixed the gcc343 regression for dhcp, now it fails because groff cored during build ...
[20:19] <blindcoder> that's overoptimisation
[20:19] <blindcoder> had it with p4
[20:19] <netrunner> hm. so just build it with smaller opt?
[20:19] <blindcoder> yes
[20:19] <blindcoder> p3 worked, p4 didn't
[20:20] <netrunner> I repeat myself, but I will say it again: we should introduce max-opt flags.
[20:22] <netrunner> hm. I think it should work from within the .conf, fiddling with the optimization flags, no?
[20:24] <blindcoder> yes
[20:24] <blindcoder> probably
[20:24] <blindcoder> substituting mcpu=p4 by pmmx for example
[20:24] <netrunner> I wonder if the sdl stuff will work on this build.
[20:25] Action: netrunner probably will install his laptop today.
[20:25] <blindcoder> who knows?
[20:25] <netrunner> hm, i could try it :)
[20:25] <blindcoder> well, I'll go to bed ;)
[20:25] <blindcoder> good night
[20:25] <netrunner> n8 blindy
[20:25] Action: netrunner wonders why blindy goes to bed so early.
[20:33] <netrunner> crystalpm-2.1.0-DEV-x86-pentium-m-32-crystal-expert:
[20:34] <netrunner> 313 builds total, 312 completed fine, 1 with errors.
[20:38] <SerWou> Hello the Chan
[20:39] <netrunner> serwous :)
[22:14] Action: netrunner working to fix gcc343 ...
[22:17] <treo> gn8
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[23:37] <mnemoc> rehi
[23:37] <owl> hi mnemoc !
[23:37] <owl> how are you old man? ;)
[23:38] Action: Aard sets owl on fire
[23:38] <owl> ah. another old man complaining about the "old man"-thingie, eh? 
[23:39] <mnemoc> owl: old
[23:39] <mnemoc> and you?
[23:39] <owl> mnemoc: hehe. nah, how are you, not what are you?
[23:39] <owl> mnemoc: too young :( 
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[00:00] --- Thu Nov 18 2004