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[08:13] <netrunner> moin
[08:42] <blindcoder> moin
[08:48] <netrunner> nessus is going closed source
[08:48] <blindcoder> yeah
[08:48] <blindcoder> old news
[08:48] <blindcoder> olds :)
[08:49] <netrunner> kopete somehow sucks.
[08:50] Action: netrunner looking for alternative !gaim
[08:50] <blindcoder> I'm satisfied with licq
[08:52] <netrunner> blindcoder: as far as I can see it only supports icq?
[08:52] <blindcoder> 13:45 to 14:30
[08:52] <blindcoder> yes, it does
[08:54] <netrunner> yes it dows more or yes it does only support icq?
[08:54] <netrunner> do you want tea of coffe? yes.
[08:54] <netrunner> grml
[08:55] <blindcoder> AFAIK it only supports icq
[09:31] <daja77> kopete in kde 3.4.2 was quite ok
[09:57] <blindcoder> daja77: the talk list is online
[09:57] <blindcoder> I'm on at 13:45
[10:08] <netrunner> daja77: it misses jabber (fixing) and crashes with russian contacts and looses icq connection.
[10:16] <daja77> I only use it for msn
[11:06] <esden> wahh wahh wahh wahh!!! *sigh*
[11:06] <esden> morning
[11:06] <blindcoder> moin esden 
[11:06] <blindcoder> esden: what's up?
[11:07] <esden> this is up: http://www.esden.net/blog/2005/10/03/pixelpost/ <- read the post if you have not yet and then the comment
[11:08] <esden> she is right on the one hand on the other hand simply underinformed about her/his own softawer
[11:09] <blindcoder> well, I just hope icculus doesn't find my rant about neverball :)
[11:09] <esden> hehe ;)
[11:10] <daja77> esden: don't yell at me
[11:10] <esden> you must not critisize open source software ... they do it for free ... so they are not bound to any software quality guidelines
[11:10] <esden> daja77: ?o_O?
[11:10] <esden> daja77: I do not yell at you o_O
[11:10] <daja77> 10:17 < daja77> I only use it for msn
[11:10] <daja77> 11:07 < esden> wahh wahh wahh wahh!!! *sigh*
[11:10] <blindcoder> esden: yeah, include that reply when you post your patches to them :D
[11:11] <esden> hehe ;)
[11:11] <daja77> wtf is ahmed hussein and why is he fullquoting messages without add a message
[11:11] <blindcoder> no idea
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[11:21] <blindcoder> lunchtime
[11:23] <daja77> hm breakfast ...
[11:51] Action: netrunner packing out banana
[12:03] <blindcoder> re
[12:08] Action: netrunner being bashed for sodomi in $otherchannel :(
[12:08] <blindcoder> o_O
[12:09] <netrunner> maybe I chose the wrong words to explain my first experiences of sleeping with a cat on the weekend.
[12:10] <daja77> hehe
[12:23] <esden> wow ... that is a big e-mail I produced here ... 
[12:30] <blindcoder> o_O
[12:31] <blindcoder> okay, documentation updated for LVP 0.5.0 
[12:34] <blindcoder> no more kernel patching necessary :)
[12:35] <daja77> hm a new target ...
[12:35] <blindcoder> new target?
[12:37] <daja77> guess I'd need one for the zaurus
[12:38] <blindcoder> thinking of paranoia, I remember a fellow kendoka even pays his membership in cash because he doesn't want everyone and their dog to know from it being reported on his bank account
[12:39] <daja77> what membership?
[12:39] <blindcoder> for the Kokugikan e.V.
[12:39] <blindcoder> the kendo/iaido/judo club he's in
[12:40] <blindcoder> he also asked t-mobile if he can pay his bill in cash
[12:40] <daja77> O_o
[12:40] <daja77> and they said no?
[12:40] <blindcoder> he's paranoid
[12:41] <blindcoder> and he's net even a geek :)
[12:41] <daja77> hehe
[12:41] <blindcoder> well, no, but he didn't give them a "Einzugsermaechtigung"
[12:41] <daja77> that's ok
[12:41] <blindcoder> so he goes to the t-punkt with his bill everytime :)
[12:41] <daja77> hrhr
[12:47] Action: netrunner also prefers not to give direct debit authorisation to certain institutions
[12:51] <blindcoder> for example?
[12:56] <netrunner> T-Com
[12:57] <blindcoder> heh
[12:57] <blindcoder> no more t-com for me
[12:57] <blindcoder> only t-mobile
[13:06] <esden> I am really eager to see what Connie answers ;)
[13:06] <blindcoder> hehe
[13:06] <esden> read
[13:06] <blindcoder> can I see the mail?
[13:06] <esden> I wrote a monster mail!
[13:06] <esden> sure
[13:06] <blindcoder> where?
[13:07] <esden> I send it to scavenger
[13:07] <esden> is that ok?
[13:07] <blindcoder> sure
[13:07] <esden> it is in german ... I have to translate and modify for their forum and for my blog
[13:08] <blindcoder> heh, now I see it
[13:08] <blindcoder> http://forum.pixelpost.org/showthread.php?p=15994
[13:08] <esden> mail forwarded to you
[13:08] <blindcoder> thanks :)
[13:09] <esden> ups it is encoded
[13:09] <esden> sorry ... mail does it automatically :/
[13:09] <blindcoder> doesn't matter
[13:10] <esden> ok
[13:13] <esden> tell me what you think blindcoder when you are ready reading
[13:14] <blindcoder> heh, nice mail
[13:14] <blindcoder> guess I couldn't have sent such a calm response
[13:14] <esden> I know :)
[13:14] <esden> I slept over it and calmed down ... that really helps ;)
[13:14] <blindcoder> thanks for believing in me :P$
[13:15] <blindcoder> bah, I'd have been just as pissed the next day :P
[13:15] <esden> blindcoder: hehe ... I know you too good ... and I like you the way you are ... sbtw
[13:15] <blindcoder> HORAAY! \o/
[13:15] <blindcoder> guess I'll post a mail to mutt-users now
[13:16] <esden> hehe ... do it ... give them a bashing which they have not known ;)
[13:17] <esden> ok .. I have to leave ... now
[13:17] <esden> cu
[13:17] <blindcoder> bye
[13:25] owl (n=owl@62.4.80.218) joined #rocklinux.
[13:25] <owl> hi
[13:28] <blindcoder> moin owl 
[13:33] <owl> hi blindy
[13:42] <blindcoder> okay, now I need esden to send me another mail to test the solution
[13:48] <netrunner> blindcoder: I bought a galaxy now. the heavy hunter thing.
[13:51] <blindcoder> sweet
[13:51] <blindcoder> netrunner: I remember9 I had the Demon milspec one
[13:51] <esden> re
[13:52] <blindcoder> wb esden 
[13:52] <blindcoder> esden: can you send me another mail?
[13:52] <blindcoder> I got a wuergaround from mutt-susers list
[13:53] <blindcoder> munging the headers from procmail >_<
[13:57] <netrunner> blindcoder: without cargo?
[13:59] <blindcoder> netrunner: no idea, I mostly used it for headhunting and protecting cargo ships
[14:00] <blindcoder> it _is_ a flying weapon after all :)
[14:01] <esden> ok ... one moment
[14:03] <esden> humm ... it is not possible from here ... damn cisco vpn >_<
[14:04] <blindcoder> o_O
[14:04] <esden> ok ... done
[14:04] <esden> sent through the local mail GW
[14:05] <blindcoder> YAY
[14:05] <blindcoder> works :)
[14:09] <esden> good ;)
[14:13] <blindcoder> although mutt insists that this way of sending PGP data is totally deprecated :P
[14:14] <blindcoder> hmm
[14:15] <blindcoder> if this continues I'll have to insists on being included in the "Credits" section of fisheye
[14:15] <daja77> ?
[14:15] <blindcoder> so far I've reported no less than 4 serious bugs in that software
[14:15] <blindcoder> and they're only at -beta3
[14:17] <owl> fscked satanisten-pack *pukes*
[14:19] <blindcoder> what now?
[14:20] <owl> blindcoder: long story -> query?
[14:21] <owl> at least i will go to a lawyer soon & contact the "rainbow-press" ... (computerbild) 
[14:22] <blindcoder> o_O
[14:23] <owl> this is the only way... my NB is away since 22. august (about 1,5 month) - and will at least take another 4 weeks!
[14:24] <blindcoder> ouch
[14:24] Action: netrunner starts liking gotos
[14:26] Action: blindcoder whacks netrunner with a broken label
[14:30] <owl> yes. 
[14:31] <esden> blindcoder: yes give him more .. gimme also a broken label and I help you whacking netrunner 
[14:31] Action: netrunner blocks by doing a far jump somewhere else
[14:32] <netrunner> hehe, now iterate behind me :)
[14:32] Action: esden doing a 64bit far jump behind netrunner 
[14:32] Action: netrunner goingto yet another place
[14:32] Action: blindcoder casts netrunner to void
[14:32] Action: netrunner segfaults on blindcoder
[14:33] Action: blindcoder coredumps on esden 
[14:33] <blindcoder> brb
[14:33] <esden> bleah .. netrunner is dumping core on blindcoder 
[14:33] <esden> waaaahhhh
[14:33] <owl> hi esden 
[14:33] Action: esden flattend by a core
[14:33] Action: esden dinning out from the dump
[14:34] <esden> blindcoder: you are disgusting
[14:47] <blindcoder> thanks :)
[15:01] <esden> ooook ... going home ... cu
[15:04] <owl> bye esden 
[15:09] <blindcoder> *hoil*
[15:09] <blindcoder> some people are so stupid that you have to wonder how they can remember to breathe regularly
[15:09] <owl> blindcoder: satan called you?
[15:10] <blindcoder> no, read an email >_<
[15:10] <owl> blindcoder: you don't tell me news :) what did they do?
[15:10] <blindcoder> well, someone asked about a suggestion for a router
[15:10] <blindcoder> someone suggested him the WRT54G
[15:10] <blindcoder> and the OP replied: No, thanks, that's one of the slow 11 MBit/s router. I want a 54 MBit/s router (802.11g)
[15:11] <owl> O_O 
[15:11] <owl> http://www.idealo.de/preisvergleich/OffersOfProduct/60985.html <- this router? ;)
[15:11] <blindcoder> Well, WHAT THE FUCK DO YOU THINK THE "54" AND THE "G" IN "WRT54G" STAND FOR, ASS?
[15:12] <owl> hihi :)
[15:13] <blindcoder> yeah, that's the one
[15:13] <owl> then he/she/it is even too dumb to ask google 
[15:13] <blindcoder> just that it has 4x RJ45
[15:15] <owl> ah, ok
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[15:41] Nick change: menomc -> mnemoc
[15:59] <daja77> http://www.heise.de/newsticker/meldung/64755 :D
[16:00] <blindcoder> hmm
[16:00] <blindcoder> website hits on lvp just went through the roof
[16:01] <blindcoder> hmm
[16:01] <blindcoder> I really wonder if I should do a LVP workshop :)
[16:01] <daja77> on clt?
[16:01] <blindcoder> anywhere :)
[16:02] Action: daja77 points blindcoder to the url above
[16:02] <blindcoder> yeah, already read it
[16:02] <daja77> :)
[16:02] <blindcoder> but LVP doesn't exactly mix with debian day :)
[16:03] <daja77> it doesn't have to
[16:04] <blindcoder> true
[16:09] <blindcoder> guess I should do more LVP releases
[16:09] <blindcoder> I have made the gigantic sum of TWO releases this year :)
[16:09] <daja77> hehe
[16:09] <blindcoder> and almost 40 subscribers o_O
[16:16] <blindcoder> YAY
[16:16] <blindcoder> in 12 days LVP will celebrate its second birthday!
[16:16] <netrunner> at least then it should reach level of being useful *ducknrun*
[16:16] <blindcoder> netrunner: it is now
[16:17] <blindcoder> netrunner: no need to patch anything anymore to use the encryption feature
[16:17] Action: blindcoder had to contact archive.org to see when I released 0.1 :)
[16:20] Action: netrunner thinking about which customers would want their videos to be encrypted...
[16:20] <blindcoder> paranoid ones :)
[16:20] <blindcoder> also, you don't _need_ to encrypt them
[16:21] <blindcoder> and then you have a livecd that can play them on any peesee
[16:21] <blindcoder> so you don't have to rely on someone else to have the necessary codecs installed
[16:22] <netrunner> blindcoder: yes, but you have to ask the one pc used and set up for presentations to be shut down :)
[16:22] <blindcoder> you can still play them with an installed video player
[16:23] <blindcoder> given that it has the necessary coders
[16:23] <blindcoder> codecs
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[16:29] <kasal> Hi, I placed a patch in packages/public/xpdf/, and it is not applied correctly.
[16:30] <netrunner> kasal: can you define 'is not applied correctly' in more detail?
[16:31] <kasal> ... yes, I wanted to type second sentence, but I got caught with another problem before I discovered the details.
[16:31] <kasal> Sorry.  Please wait another 10 sec.
[16:32] <kasal> I think the problem is in build_this_package (in scripts/functions, of course):
[16:32] <netrunner> kasal: no. 
[16:32] <kasal> it calls apply_patchfiles in the loop "for xsrctar in $xsourceballs; do"
[16:33] <kasal> So in my case, where we have 2 tarballs (t1lib and xpdf), it tries to apply my patch after the t1lib tarball is unpacked,
[16:33] <kasal> but before the xpdf tarball is unpacked.
[16:33] blindcod1r (n=blindcod@dslb-084-059-046-133.pools.arcor-ip.net) joined #rocklinux.
[16:34] <kasal> And I guess that it would try to apply the patch again after the second tarball is applied.
[16:34] <blindcod1r> kasal: what's the patches name?
[16:34] <blindcod1r> kasal: and how was it diffed?
[16:34] blindcoder (n=blindcod@dslb-084-059-051-151.pools.arcor-ip.net) left irc: Nick collision from services.
[16:34] <netrunner> kasal: call the patch .diff, so it doesn't get applied automatically, then edit xpdf.conf and apply the patch in the section where t1lib is handeled.
[16:34] Nick change: blindcod1r -> blindcoder
[16:35] <kasal> My personal tiny patch.  Starts with "--- ./xpdf-3.01/xpdf/pdftotext.cc", so that -p1 gives you xpdf-3.01/...
[16:35] <blindcoder> xpdf is a bit special because it has multiple downloads
[16:35] <blindcoder> call it foo.patch.t1lib
[16:36] <kasal> ... no, I need patch.xpdf .
[16:36] <blindcoder> see http://doc.rocklinux.org/wiki/PackageFilesReference where it says *.patch.<sourcetar> 
[16:36] <kasal> Yes, it was there before I made my personal upgrade to 3.01.
[16:36] <blindcoder> ah, okay
[16:37] <kasal> OK, this is solved, thank you very much.
[16:37] <blindcoder> you're welcome :)
[16:37] <kasal> While I'm here, I'd like to discuss pkgfork.
[16:37] <blindcoder> go ahead
[16:37] <kasal> First, it's about 1 month since I studied it.  I hope there was no huge change since then.
[16:38] <blindcoder> no
[16:38] <blindcoder> hasn't changed recently
[16:39] <kasal> My personal target for a "minimal black-box system" contains: config.in:pkgfilter awk -f target/extract/pkgsel.awk
[16:39] <blindcoder> hmm
[16:39] <blindcoder> better use $base/target
[16:39] <kasal> The problem is that by the time this is executed, some packages are already forked, and some aren't yet forked.
[16:40] <kasal> ?
[16:40] <blindcoder> nevermind
[16:40] <kasal> $base/target?  what is it?
[16:40] <blindcoder> $base is a variable that always points to the root of the rock-src directory
[16:40] <blindcoder> so I suggest this: pkgfilter awk -f $base/target/extract/pkgsel.awk
[16:40] <netrunner> kasal: you can read Documentation/Developers/PKG-BUILD_VARIABLES (or similar)
[16:41] <kasal> ok, I inserted "$base/"
[16:41] Action: kasal knows that there is plenty of things to read.
[16:41] <blindcoder> kasal: I don't think it matters in your case, but it's a nice training to always do so :)
[16:41] <blindcoder> now, with the package forking
[16:42] Action: kasal also knows that some questions may sound silly, because I haven't read much of the docs.
[16:42] <blindcoder> which are the packages not already forked?L
[16:42] <kasal> ... but ROCK is a young project, so I think it's better to come and ask then to plan for reading, putting it off, ...
[16:42] <kasal> ... and finally ending up with debian.  :-(
[16:43] Action: kasal is searching "which are the packages not already forked?"
[16:43] <blindcoder> kasal: no, you said there are some packages already forked and some not forked
[16:44] <blindcoder> what's the problem with that, sorry if I confused you :)
[16:44] <kasal> gcc is not forked yet,
[16:44] <kasal> [ not confused, I just have to spend some time between speaking,
[16:45] <kasal>   because it's some time since I discovered the problem, and I don't remember some details. ]
[16:45] <blindcoder> ah, okay
[16:45] <blindcoder> well, gcc only forks into the enabled gcc versions anyway
[16:45] <kasal> gcc is not forked yet, because pkgfork is called in config-300.in, not prefork.
[16:46] <blindcoder> true
[16:46] <kasal> What's the problem: my pkgsel.awk reads in list of packages (similarly as in the router target)
[16:46] <blindcoder> but you can control the gcc forks with the ROCKCFG_PKG_GCC_GCC{2,32,33,34,40,41} variables
[16:46] <blindcoder> okay
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[16:47] <kasal> the list contains "gcc" (not gcc=gccXY), but it contains bash=bash2.
[16:47] <blindcoder> yes, because bash forks earlier
[16:47] <kasal> I find this a bit annoying...
[16:47] <kasal> BUT NOW
[16:48] <kasal> for something completely different!
[16:48] <blindcoder> okay :)
[16:48] karasz (n=chatzill@80.97.102.202) left #rocklinux.
[16:48] <kasal> I have a patch for package/base/bash:
[16:48] <blindcoder> okay
[16:49] <kasal> Index: package/base/bash/preconfig.in
[16:49] <kasal> ===================================================================
[16:49] <kasal> --- package/base/bash/preconfig.in      (revision 6377)
[16:49] <kasal> +++ package/base/bash/preconfig.in      (working copy)
[16:49] <kasal> @@ -24,10 +24,10 @@
[16:49] <kasal>  then
[16:49] <kasal>         if [ "$ROCKCFG_PKG_BASH_DEFAULT" == "bash2" ]; then
[16:49] <kasal>                 pkgfork bash bash2
[16:49] <kasal> -               pkgfork bash bash3 stages "-----5---9"
[16:49] <kasal> +               pkgfork bash bash3 stages "-----5---9" version 3.0
[16:49] <kasal>         elif [ "$ROCKCFG_PKG_BASH_DEFAULT" == "bash3" ]; then
[16:49] <kasal>                 pkgfork bash bash2 stages "-----5---9"
[16:49] <kasal> -               pkgfork bash bash3
[16:49] <kasal> +               pkgfork bash bash3 version 3.0
[16:49] <blindcoder> URGS
[16:49] <kasal>         fi
[16:49] <kasal>          pkgremove bash
[16:49] <kasal>  fi
[16:49] <kasal> Index: package/base/bash/pkgmapper.in
[16:50] <kasal> ===================================================================
[16:50] <kasal> --- package/base/bash/pkgmapper.in      (revision 0)
[16:50] <kasal> +++ package/base/bash/pkgmapper.in      (revision 0)
[16:50] <kasal> @@ -0,0 +1,3 @@
[16:50] <kasal> +case $pkg in
[16:50] <kasal> +  bash[23]) pkg=bash;;
[16:50] <kasal> +esac
[16:50] <kasal> -- I hope you don't mind tis long paste.
[16:50] <kasal> Does "URGS" mean you mind it?
[16:50] <daja77> in fact we do
[16:50] <blindcoder> yes
[16:50] <blindcoder> okay, first
[16:50] <kasal> OK, so I apologize.
[16:50] <blindcoder> pkg never contains bash[23]
[16:50] <blindcoder> that's in xpxkg
[16:51] <blindcoder> and the "version 3.0" after the package fork is also unnecessary
[16:51] <blindcoder> since that is checked for in bash.desc
[16:51] <blindcoder> see the lines "#if xpkg == bash2" and "#if xpkg == bash3"
[16:52] <kasal> ... I apologize for the paste, but I didn't meant to submit the patch, I meant to discuss it, since I think it illustrates some flaws with the "pkgfork" design.
[16:52] <kasal> But I won't paste again, I understand now.
[16:52] <blindcoder> kasal: try to use a pastebin next time :)
[16:53] <blindcoder> so, why do you think pkgfork is flawed?
[16:53] <blindcoder> I don't get it ;)
[16:53] <kasal> I don't know pastebin, let it be for now, before I have to hurry.
[16:53] <kasal> we'll get to it.
[16:53] <blindcoder> okay
[16:54] <kasal> First: pkg vs. xpkg:  I used package/base/bdb/pkgmapper.in as a template.
[16:54] <kasal> But I think the fact that pkgmapper.in has to exist is a flaw.  The information is redundant.
[16:55] <blindcoder> I don't get this pkgmapper.in thingie in bdb either
[16:55] <blindcoder> it _is_ redundant
[16:55] <blindcoder> in fact, I don't use it for my pkgforks
[16:55] <blindcoder> It _might_ be...
[16:55] <blindcoder> let me try something
[16:56] <blindcoder> ah, okay
[16:56] <blindcoder> got it
[16:56] <blindcoder> it's a kind of "backwards compatibility"
[16:56] <blindcoder> so, with pkgforking
[16:56] <blindcoder> you would have to type:
[16:56] <kasal> ... I'll have to leave soon, so I'll end my part and run, we can then discuss it later.
[16:56] <blindcoder> ./scripts/Build-Pkg bash=bash2
[16:56] <blindcoder> to get bash2
[16:56] <kasal> [I know this is not much polite, sorry...]
[16:56] <blindcoder> but with the pkgmapper.in you can do
[16:56] <blindcoder> ./scripts/Build-Pkg bash2
[16:56] <blindcoder> and it will be recognized
[16:57] <blindcoder> okay, I need to lreave, too :)
[16:57] <blindcoder> kendo training
[16:57] <blindcoder> I'll be back around 20:30 - 21:00
[16:57] <kasal> ... I still think "version 3.0" is needed.
[16:57] <blindcoder> remind me to write a rockdoc entry about the pkgmapper.in file
[16:57] <kasal> ... No, I won't.  I'll propose a more aggressive change to pkgfork.
[16:57] <blindcoder> it might be, yes
[16:58] <blindcoder> or that :)
[16:58] <blindcoder> kasal: though I think that one would be better placed at the mailing list then
[16:58] <kasal> without version 3.0, the version number in config/*/packages{,.txt} moght contain wrong ver number
[16:58] <kasal> and it is then displayed to the user in script/Config
[16:59] <blindcoder> ah, I see
[16:59] <kasal> .... yeah, I planned to subscribe to the list and then mail there for ages.
[16:59] <blindcoder> heh, okay :)
[16:59] <blindcoder> anyway, I gotta leave or the highway will be jammed
[16:59] <blindcoder> see you later!
[17:00] <kasal> I know this wasn't the best way to present my ideas, but waiting for time to make it perfectly, I woudn't do it at all.
[17:00] <kasal> see you!
[17:00] <blindcoder> send it to the list or talk to me this evening
[17:00] <kasal> So thanks to all for patience, even though 
[17:00] <blindcoder> both are fine :)
[17:00] <blindcoder> you're welcome
[17:00] <kasal> ... I'll talk or mail tomorrow.
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[18:56] <owl> re
[19:40] <esden> re hi ho
[19:45] <owl> wb esden 
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[20:55] <[raphael]> hi *
[20:56] <[raphael]> where can I put my order for an AMD64 crystal build down?
[21:01] <[raphael]> never mind, just joking
[21:01] <[raphael]> but still, I'm wondering if anyone of you has an amd64 build host
[21:06] <blindcoder> re
[21:06] <blindcoder> not that I knw of
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[21:40] <th> at least i've a powerfull athlon64 machine
[21:42] <th> but never bootstrapped amd64 build there
[22:04] <blindcoder> then it's about time :)
[22:14] <th> you're right. it's all about TIME
[22:15] <th> especially having time or dont
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[23:18] <esden> wow I am sooooo goood ... jumparound
[23:18] <esden> dadadadada
[23:20] <mnemoc> o.o
[23:20] <esden> hehe ... mnemoc I wrote an email ... and it did hit the soft spot ... I love it
[23:22] <mnemoc> :)
[00:00] --- Tue Oct 11 2005