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[13:07] <blindcoder> okay, no livecd for CLT
[13:08] <blindcoder> "unable to open an initial console"
[13:08] <blindcoder> and I don't fele like fixing that right now
[13:09] <daja77> hm i get this message for crystal too but it boots up anyway
[13:13] <blindcoder> livecd doesn't
[13:14] <blindcoder> and I really don't have the time or desire to fix it right now
[13:14] <daja77> well yeah the livecd is out of maintainance for months ..
[13:14] <daja77> don't worry, you've done a lot already
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[15:27] <th> oh finally the modules load in stage1 of bootdisk
[15:28] <th> but i think we should make all drivers available as module only (not statically in kernel) that way we'll be able to split modules disks later
[16:03] <blindcoder> okay, ROCK DVDs and CDs are being created as I write this
[16:03] <blindcoder> for any changes it is too late now
[16:04] <th> bad luck for scsi-guys with dell poweredgeds
[16:05] <th> (just sent my bootdisk/stage1 fix for this)
[16:05] <icelbox> hm, who uses dell poweredges? ^^
[16:05] <icelbox> except at work I mean...
[16:06] <th> are we focussing personal use only?
[16:06] <th> i've lots of poweredges in production with rock
[16:07] <daja77> blindcoder: any idea why wesnoth fails?
[16:07] <icelbox> hm, I must not install anything else than redcrap on "mine"
[16:08] <th> well - i'm taking decisions here
[16:09] <icelbox> you're lucky then :)
[16:09] <blindcoder> daja77: it doesn't here
[16:10] <daja77> sigh
[16:10] <daja77> make[2]: *** No rule to make target `utils/wmlxgettext', needed by `all-am'.  Stop.
[16:10] <th> blindcoder, daja77: do you agree that we should built as much as possible as a module for bootdisk?
[16:10] <th> and that we should put all modules in stage1 (so we could split modules-discs later)
[16:11] <blindcoder> daja77: if you give me the .err I might be able to say something more
[16:12] <blindcoder> th: yes
[16:12] <blindcoder> daja77: current version of wesnoth?
[16:12] <blindcoder> daja77: I mean, current version in TRUNK?L
[16:13] <daja77> 1.0
[16:13] <daja77> http://lospalmos.homelinux.net/wesnoth.err
[16:13] <blindcoder> humm
[16:14] <blindcoder> bzip2: Compressed file ends unexpectedly;
[16:14] <blindcoder> 	perhaps it is corrupted?  *Possible* reason follows.
[16:14] <blindcoder> I would say that that is the error
[16:14] <daja77> d'oh
[16:15] <daja77> haven't seen that
[16:19] <daja77> sigh, the freetype check fails because it doesn't link against cairo and cairopango
[16:23] Action: netrunner now had also blog comment spam :)
[16:25] <blindcoder> hehe
[16:26] <blindcoder> currently the blog spammer are as stupid as never before
[16:26] <blindcoder> just using the 'contact' form
[16:26] <blindcoder> there's only the word 'phentermine' in the 'name' field
[16:26] <blindcoder> the rest is emptyp
[16:26] <blindcoder> no link, no nothing
[16:32] <daja77> argl this damn gnome/gtk crap
[16:36] Action: netrunner going with public transport to pick up his car from tuev
[16:37] <daja77> hrhr
[16:37] <daja77> --disable-freetypetest
[16:39] <daja77> th: let's discuss this on the weekend please, i am distracted now ..
[16:40] <th> do we have some list of topics somewhere already?
[16:41] <blindcoder> no
[16:41] <blindcoder> unless you count 'sit together and talk about stuff we need to talk about'
[16:41] <daja77> not that I am aware of
[16:51] <th> is the rock sonar not linked any longer?
[16:52] <th> ahh it was sonar.rl.org
[16:53] <blindcoder> a lot of stuff died with the transition to the wiki
[16:53] <th> yea - and the logo is cropped
[16:54] <blindcoder> right
[16:56] Last message repeated 1 time(s).
[16:56] <blindcoder> just checked in the Crystal-CLT data
[16:58] <daja77> sigh
[16:58] <daja77> cairo is a non autodetected pita
[17:23] Nick change: _BoS_ -> BoS|afk
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[18:03] <owl> re
[19:06] <blindcoder> okay
[19:06] <blindcoder> labeling and writing done
[19:06] <blindcoder> time to go home
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[21:21] <daja77> wtf?
[21:21] <daja77> 586-unknown-linux-gnu/bin/ld: qemu-i386: Not enough room for program headers (allocated 8, need 9)
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[21:31] <blindcod1r> btw, i have 50 discs altogether
[21:31] <blindcod1r> 25 CDs
[21:31] <blindcod1r> and 25 DVDs which contain the download/ dir, too
[21:31] Nick change: blindcod1r -> blindcoder
[21:51] <owl> O_O blindcoder ?
[21:52] <blindcoder> owl: !
[21:52] <owl> wtf are you doing with all the downloads?
[21:52] <blindcoder> owl: no downloads
[21:52] <blindcoder> owl: Crystal ROCK CLT-Version discs
[21:52] <owl> hrm. ok
[21:53] <owl> .oO( LT 2001... rock 1.5 - d'ouh, that was a time... )
[21:54] <blindcoder> hehe
[21:55] <owl> don't laugh :) it was funny ... _was_
[21:55] <blindcoder> no idea
[21:55] <blindcoder> haven't been there
[21:55] <owl> *g* 
[21:56] <owl> well. it was nice... lying on the sofa, sleeping on a notebook... and the first thing you saw when you opened your eyes where nice geeks *g*
[21:57] <owl> and then, taking the s-bahn, you had a chat in RL with a nice person... d'ouh, iam missing such things
[21:58] <blindcoder> hehe
[21:58] <owl> why are you laughing? :)
[22:00] <blindcoder> just because :)
[22:00] <owl> .oO( men ;)
[22:01] <blindcoder> women
[22:02] <owl> pff ;)
[22:15] <th> are there any objections to having a bbs (build-bootstrap) package selection?
[22:15] <th> ATM we have a minimal.in
[22:15] <th> which does not even contain curl
[22:15] <th> nor ssh
[22:16] <blindcoder> we need at least curl for bbs
[22:16] <th> you can't do ./scripts/Config without curl
[22:16] <blindcoder> ssh is not necessary
[22:16] <blindcoder> although I would vote for a pkgsplit ssh:server and ssh:client
[22:17] <th> minimal is 145MB at the moment
[22:17] <th> i booted from bootdisk on a dell machine today and just wanted to make this system ready for building.
[22:17] <th> so i extracted a minimal-set and wanted to go home.
[22:18] <th> but i could not.
[22:18] <th> cause i would not've been able to login
[22:18] <blindcoder> yeah
[22:18] <th> because ssh was missing
[22:18] <blindcoder> I would have loved to hand out livecd+source tomorrow
[22:18] <blindcoder> but livecd is broken >_<
[22:18] <th> i had to use a usb-stick to transfer openssl, curl, openssh
[22:18] <th> i think a bootable cd with a bbs package-set is a must-have
[22:19] <daja77> .oO (hate day)
[22:19] <th> propably similar to a live-system build-system
[22:19] <blindcoder> daja77: hate-four-weeks >_<
[22:19] <th> so to not interfere with the minimal set i would propose to fork it and create a bbs
[22:19] <blindcoder> daja77: yes, that's what I wanted to achieve the easy way with the livecd
[22:19] <th> dedicated for easy build startup
[22:20] <daja77> 1607 builds total, 1559 completed fine, 48 with errors.
[22:20] <th> so i'd like to include ssh/curl/ping
[22:20] <daja77> here it should be ..
[22:20] <th> perhaps the minimal-pkgsel's purpose should be a running system with as few as possible
[22:21] <th> not dedicated for building
[22:21] <daja77> from 54 to 48 ..
[22:22] <blindcoder> th: sounds fine
[22:26] <th> blindcoder: ok. will do.
[22:35] <th> btw - anyone interested in club-mate on CLT?
[22:35] <blindcoder> thanks, I have other 'brechmittel'
[22:35] <th> ahh you are one of the opponents... i see
[22:36] <daja77> me too :)
[22:36] <blindcoder> :)
[22:36] <blindcoder> I just think it tastes terrible
[22:36] <daja77> but perhaps there some who like it
[22:36] <blindcoder> hannes wants some
[22:36] <blindcoder> as does lay
[22:36] <daja77> and perhaps i buy a bottle just for the sake of it
[22:36] <blindcoder> there's sake in mate? :)
[22:36] <th> who is "lay"?
[22:37] <blindcoder> hannes' girlfriend
[22:37] <blindcoder> more or less
[22:37] <th> i see
[22:37] <daja77> she has a mate shirt ^^
[22:37] <th> single bottles are free for core-devs ;-)
[22:37] <blindcoder> the girl who stayed at my place for the last two weeks
[22:37] <th> there are mate shirts??
[22:37] <blindcoder> *snif* no bottle for me
[22:37] Action: blindcoder is just a user :)
[22:38] <daja77> th: a t-shirt with the mate logo ..
[22:38] <blindcoder> a yellow t-shirt
[22:38] <blindcoder> which - btw - looks damn fine on lay
[22:38] <daja77> blindcoder: i know ^^
[22:38] <th> never seen it
[22:38] <th> pics?
[22:39] <blindcoder> the chick? or the shirt?
[22:39] <daja77> i have one .. on the laptop
[22:39] <th> blindcoder: the combination would be best
[22:39] <th> daja77: you have a chick on your laptop?
[22:40] <daja77> do I?
[22:40] <th> 22:41:34 < daja77> i have one .. on the laptop
[22:40] <daja77> one pic of her in that shirt ..
[22:41] <th> cool
[22:41] <daja77> .oO (hm chicken wings)
[22:42] <th> blindcoder: so let me ask a question to you as a udev expert...
[22:43] <daja77> hehe
[22:43] <th> blindcoder: i've just added another partition to /dev/sdc
[22:43] <blindcoder> AAAAAAARRRRRRGHHHHHHHHHHh
[22:43] <th> blindcoder: will udev ever add /dev/sdc4 to /dev?
[22:43] <daja77> roflmao
[22:43] <blindcoder> sorry, reflex
[22:43] <th> hehe ;)
[22:43] <blindcoder> th: as soon as you call udevstart
[22:43] <blindcoder> oooooohhhhhhh, but wait
[22:43] <blindcoder> there _is_ no more udevstart
[22:43] <th> udev --daemon is already running
[22:43] <blindcoder> you now have to use a strange combination of commands to do that
[22:44] <th> i thought udevd --daemon would do that for me?
[22:44] <th> or is that what `hotplug` has to do for me?
[22:44] <blindcoder> if the kernel doesn't generate an event for that, no
[22:44] <th> so we are talking of a hotplug event here?
[22:44] <blindcoder> hotplug, hald... something of that
[22:44] <blindcoder> lost the overview, really
[22:45] <blindcoder> I'm really considering going back to a static /dev directory
[22:45] <blindcoder> it's so simple... it works...
[22:45] <blindcoder> one call to mknod and it'll be there forever and ever...
[22:45] <th> so udevd is totally userspace and needs to be fed by another instance?
[22:45] <blindcoder> life could be so simple
[22:45] <blindcoder> th: correct
[22:45] <th> and that instance would be what?
[22:46] <blindcoder> hotplug or hald
[22:46] <th> i dont even now hald
[22:46] <blindcoder> netrunner has invested a lot more thought there thatn I did
[22:46] <th> i'm so yesterday
[22:46] <blindcoder> personally, I'd call udevstart
[22:46] <blindcoder> or whatever passes for udevstart these days
[22:46] <th> i dont want a quick solution (i could just mknod for now)
[22:47] <th> i want to know how we should handle this
[22:47] <blindcoder> find /sys -name uevent | while read x ; do echo 1 > $x ; donee
[22:47] <th> to see what i'm doing wrong
[22:47] <th> so that it did not appear to me
[22:47] <blindcoder> what do you have in /proc/sys/kernel/hotplug ?
[22:48] <th> /sbin/udevsend
[22:48] <th> ls: /sbin/udevsend: No such file or directory
[22:49] <th> i guess i need to update my udev package?
[22:49] <blindcoder> 084 is current
[22:49] <blindcoder> and doesn't include udevsend anymore
[22:49] <th> i see. so who has written udevsend into my /proc/sys/kernel/hotplug ?
[22:49] <th> kernel default?
[22:50] <blindcoder> oh, cool
[22:51] <th> what?
[22:51] <blindcoder> the udev installation documents do not tell us how to do this
[22:51] <blindcoder> /proc/sys/kernel/hotplug is expected to be empty
[22:51] <blindcoder> kernel default, yes
[22:51] <blindcoder> and should be emptied by an early initscript according to "the world according to udev"
[22:52] <th> expected to be empty?
[22:52] <th> what happens if that is empty?
[22:52] <blindcoder> magic
[22:52] <th> or another question: is there a replacement for udevsend?
[22:52] <blindcoder> no
[22:52] <blindcoder> it is okay if it is empty
[22:52] <th> what happens if it is empty?
[22:53] <blindcoder> /dev/ is populated by echo'ing 1 into the uevent pseudo files in /sys/=
[22:53] <th> so that is polling instead of eventing?
[22:53] <blindcoder> my best guess is that no hotplug events are generated
[22:53] <th> so searching over and over again for event files?
[22:53] <th> i see
[22:53] <blindcoder> a mix of both
[22:53] <th> a mix?
[22:53] <blindcoder> let's see...
[22:54] <th> if there is a bit of no-polling...
[22:54] <th> where shall that come from
[22:55] <blindcoder> oh, cool
[22:55] <blindcoder> I just plugged in a usb stick into a 084 system
[22:55] <blindcoder> now I have /dev/discs/disc1/generic and disc2/part1
[22:55] <th> that's because of our bad scsi-udev-helper script i think
[22:55] <th> that's full of bugs i suppose
[22:56] <blindcoder> probably
[22:56] <blindcoder> well, it work
[22:56] <blindcoder> s
[22:56] <blindcoder> but changing the partition table probably doesn't create a hotplug event
[22:56] <th> so your /proc/.../hotplug is empty?
[22:56] <blindcoder> at least it doesn't in a system I created some time ago
[22:56] <blindcoder> yes
[22:56] <th> and you are running a daemon for that besides udevd?
[22:56] <th> hald? hotplug?
[22:57] <blindcoder> no
[22:57] <th> so only udevd running?
[22:57] <blindcoder> yes
[22:57] <blindcoder> as I said
[22:57] <th> that would mean that udevd is checking for event files in sys and writing "1"s into them
[22:57] <blindcoder> I'm 99.86% sure that fdisk & co don't create the necessarry event
[22:59] <blindcoder> anyway
[22:59] <blindcoder> sleep happens
[22:59] <blindcoder> bye
[22:59] <th> cya and thanks
[22:59] <th> i'll always remember you as our udev-hero ;-)
[00:00] --- Fri Mar  3 2006