-!- Irrsi Log opened Fri Nov 15 00:00:14 2002
-!- Irrsi Day changed Fri Nov 15 2002
[00:00] < fake> i think i want to see that killing err... connect4 robot ;)
[00:00] < esden> 24 th is a sunday in the weekend after the next
[00:00] < esden> hehe
[00:00] < esden> there will also be the shooting robot
[00:00] < esden> that is finding his target automatically
[00:00] < esden> (a red ball)
[00:00] < esden> and then shoots on it
[00:01] < esden> this is a project of a third guy in our group
[00:01] < esden> it uses a webcam to find his target
[00:02] < esden> it seems to be pretty cool too
[00:02] < fake> shoots with what? high energy chemical laser?
[00:02] < esden> no with lego darts ;-)
[00:03] < fake> isn't he gonna run out of red balls pretty soon? *g*
[00:03] < fake> aw.
[00:03] < esden> hehe
[00:03] < esden> I will document our connect4 robot
[00:03] fake is gonna sleep now
[00:03] < esden> and make photos
[00:03] < esden> ok /me too
[00:03] < fake> kuhl
[00:03] < esden> gn8
[00:03] < fake> esden
[00:03] < esden> ?
[00:03] < fake> morgen abend bitz?
[00:04] < esden> nope benji
[00:04] < fake> was machen?
[00:04] < esden> sparc cluster aufbauen
[00:04] < fake> ah, okay, may i attend?
[00:04] < esden> yes you are required
[00:04] < fake> o_O
[00:04] < esden> blindcoder asked my to tell you that you have to come
[00:05] < fake> nah, we'll see later today. now sleep well ;)
[00:05] < esden> when I see you
[00:05] < esden> n8
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[01:41] < th> how to rotate a ps / pdf?
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[08:50] < esden> woot
[08:50] < esden> wlan is working
[08:50] < esden> I love this fscking university !
[08:51] < esden> noone alive ?
[08:51] < esden> ok ... I go to my lecture
[08:51] < esden> cu guys
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[09:16] < blindcoder> moin
[09:22] < fake> mornin
[09:45] < blindcoder> fake: are you on the train today?
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[10:01] < fake> blindcoder: i hope so. i'll drive to sun shortly and try to get information about that pci-pc-cards
[10:02] < fake> blindcoder: if i am lucky i might be able to implement it, but then i might take longer.
[10:02] < fake> blindcoder: but i will be in IRC ;)
[10:04] < blindcoder> fake: okay
[10:05] < blindcoder> fake: You don't have - by any chance - a PCI-NIC for me?
[10:06] < blindcoder> 570 builds total, 355 completed fine, 215 with errors.
[10:06] < blindcoder> *urks*
[10:14] -!- Freak [freak@pD953083E.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #rocklinux
[10:15] < blindcoder> hi fake
[10:15] < blindcoder> hi Freak
[10:15] < blindcoder> that way >_<
[10:21] < Freak> https://www.linuxworld.com/site-stories/2002/1113.barr.html
[10:21] < Freak> and hi all :)
[10:28] < blindcoder> *click*
[10:32] < blindcoder> *lol*
[10:32] < blindcoder> strange sounds coming out of my headphones...
[10:33] < blindcoder> "I hear dead OSes"
[10:33] < blindcoder> Sounds like a WinNT4 in a ssh X-Forwarded vmware...
[10:38] -!- owl [~mail-spam@213.68.39.1] has joined #rocklinux
[10:38] < owl> moin
[10:39] < blindcoder> moin owl
[10:39] < blindcoder> *ARGH*
[10:39] < blindcoder> Who maintains bison in 1.7?
[10:41] < owl> tach blindcoder
[10:42] < Freak> morning owliebowlie
[10:44] < owl> FREAK!!!
[10:44] < owl> tach auch
[10:44] < owl> so. away... (mal wieder...)
[10:45] < Freak> heh
[10:47] < blindcoder> mech isse wieder
[10:48] < esden> hi all
[10:48] < esden> woot
[10:48] < esden> wlan rulez
[10:48] < owl> hi esden
[10:49] < blindcoder> esden: hi
[10:49] < esden> hi blindcoder
[10:49] < blindcoder> the bison package is buggy >_<
[10:49] < esden> blindcoder: I will be earlier in in
[10:49] < esden> about 15:00
[10:49] < blindcoder> esden: sweet
[10:49] -!- rxr [~rene@port-212-202-200-98.reverse.qdsl-home.de] has joined #rocklinux
[10:49] < owl> esden: lazy student...
[10:49] < esden> owl: shut up !
[10:50] esden is working hard at the moment
[10:50] < blindcoder> echo '#!/bin/sh\nbison -y "$@"' >$root/usr/bin/yacc
[10:50] < owl> esden: i was just kidding... i guess you know..
[10:50] < owl> *it
[10:50] < blindcoder> WHO THINKSS THAT THIS WORKS?
[10:50] < esden> owl: yes ...
[10:50] < esden> blindcoder: /me knowing nothing !!
[10:50] esden is only a user
[10:51] < blindcoder> me too
[10:51] < blindcoder> and even _I_ know that it doesn't
[10:51] < blindcoder> and because of this my nethack package broke
[10:51] < esden> uups
[10:52] < blindcoder> the file $root/usr/bin/yacc looks like this then:
[10:52] < blindcoder> #!/bin/sh\nbison -y "$@"
[10:52] < blindcoder> and this DOES NAT work >_<
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[10:52] < esden> echo -e should help
[10:52] < blindcoder> yes it does
[10:53] < blindcoder> I just do a cvs up -Pd and look if it's still there
[10:53] < blindcoder> then I'll send a patch
[10:53] < blindcoder> == 10:53:24 =[5]=> Building blindcoder/nethack [3.4.0 1.7-snapshot].
[10:53] < blindcoder> -> Reading package configuration from pkg dir.
[10:53] < blindcoder> -> Preparing build in src.nethack.1037354000.20026.1791500921
[10:53] < blindcoder> -> Building. Writing output to /var/adm/logs/5-nethack.out
[10:53] < blindcoder> -> $root/var/adm/logs/5-nethack.out -> 5-nethack.log
[10:53] < blindcoder> == 11/15/02 10:55:15 =[5]=> Finished building package nethack.
[10:53] < blindcoder> SWEET
[10:54] < blindcoder> with all options changed, it did work!
[10:54] < blindcoder> *jump* *happy*
[10:56] < blindcoder> okay, that error is still there
[10:57] < blindcoder> I hope I don't screw up again
[10:58] < blindcoder> hmm...
[10:59] < blindcoder> will the ML be intereted in a -D (%-verbose) switch for cp and mv? :)
[11:01] esden looking confused at blindcoder
[11:02] < blindcoder> cp -D file /anotherpartiton/file
[11:02] < blindcoder> fil: 1% copied
[11:02] < blindcoder> \rfile: 12 copied
[11:02] < blindcoder> \rfile: 2% copied
[11:02] < blindcoder> \rfile: 3% copied
[11:02] < blindcoder> ...
[11:02] < blindcoder> \rfile: 100% copied\n
[11:03] < blindcoder> works with cp and mv :)
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[11:05] < blindcoder> moin huebi_
[11:05] < blindcoder> moin SMP__
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[11:08] < blindcoder> okay, yacc patch is out
[11:09] < blindcoder> still don't know whether to send nethack-packagfe
[11:15] < esden> SEND IT !
[11:16] < blindcoder> okay, okay >_<
[11:16] < blindcoder> but the implementation of the config doesn't make me happy
[11:20] < blindcoder> sent it
[11:24] < esden> good
[11:25] < blindcoder> will have to change some things in it for a cleaner solution
[11:25] < blindcoder> but for now it works :)
[11:27] < blindcoder> I think I'll creat a licq-package when I'm home
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[11:38] < blindcoder> moin bluefire
[11:38] < owl> moin bluefire
[11:39] < bluefire> moin folks
[11:39] < owl> urgs... you have too much time, if you're compiling our product on my workstation... it's too slow... *yawning*
[11:40] < blindcoder> heeh
[11:40] < owl> blindcoder: hm?
[11:41] < blindcoder> get a new ws then or create a cluster
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[11:58] < owl> blindcoder: if you have too much money, i will give you my account-nr. to enable you to send me money for a new WS
[11:59] < Freak> owl: btw it's a toothache, not pain in teeth *hrhr*
[12:00] < owl> Freak: na und?
[12:01] < Freak> I just thought I should tell ya ;)
[12:01] < owl> thx. my dictionary is dict.leo.org, not Freak :P
[12:01] < Freak> well noone asked you if you wanted my commentary ;)
[12:02] < owl> brb
[12:03] < Freak> bbt (be back tonite ,)
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[12:07] < fake> blindcoder: i have several. 10 or 100?
[12:07] < [anders]> narf.. /me now trying to get a mini build of Rock using uClibc to work..
[12:08] < [anders]> interesting work, as it wants to install various things where it should not install them... like in the host OS filesystem f.ex....
[12:10] < fake> urgh
[12:10] < blindcoder> fake: 10 should suffice, since the hub is 10 only, too
[12:11] < blindcoder> [anders]: interesting, indeed....
[12:12] < blindcoder> fake: I just don't want the SparcStations to be in the same physical network as the rest
[12:12] < fake> hae?
[12:13] < fake> 10 mbit fuer den fileserver?
[12:13] < blindcoder> ich hab nur noch nen 10er hub
[12:13] < fake> und nen 10er hub? fuer nfs? wieviele clients hast du?
[12:13] [anders] wonders if he has just shafted the host os...
[12:13] < blindcoder> 5 clients
[12:13] < fake> 5*10 != 10
[12:13] < blindcoder> [anders]: hmm... I don't hope so
[12:14] < blindcoder> gib mir noch nen 100er hub dazu
[12:14] < fake> [ 5*10 != 10 ] && get_a_100mbit_hub
[12:14] < fake> blindcoder: okay...
[12:14] < fake> moment
[12:14] < fake> nehma doch den vom bitz
[12:14] < fake> liegt doch eh nur rum
[12:15] < blindcoder> ich hab ja schon den 10er ausm bitz :)
[12:15] < fake> aeh der ausm bitz kann eh _nur_ 100
[12:15] < blindcoder> den hab ich seit dem letzten CCC daheim :)
[12:15] < [anders]> blindcoder: indeed I have.. ah well, time to re-install gcc then..
[12:15] < fake> the centrecom one?
[12:15] < blindcoder> [anders]: as long as it's just gcc
[12:15] < blindcoder> fake: yes
[12:16] < fake> hehe
[12:16] < [anders]> blindcoder: and possibly some libc links..
[12:16] < blindcoder> that brown/gray centrecom-10-mbit-hub
[12:16] < [anders]> nope, not shafted libc (which was incredibly nice..)
[12:21] < [anders]> apt-get install --reinstall gcc solved the problem.. how handy! :)
[12:21] < blindcoder> hehe
[12:21] < blindcoder> back, just had to answer a call
[12:21] < blindcoder> shit fucking windows
[12:22] [anders] will have to remember that command, the feeling is that until I have got uClibc to install properly, that will have to be run _many_ times..
[12:22] < blindcoder> It rebooted for the oixth time now, and so far I've been unable to do as much as open a text-file
[12:25] < blindcoder> fake: I think I've got an idea how to do it
[12:25] < th> which USB2.0 hardware is currently in 2.4.19 kernel? some pcmcia stuff?
[12:26] < blindcoder> I use my 10/100 hub for the SparcStations etc
[12:26] < blindcoder> fake: and my WS gets connected to the server via Cross-Cable
[12:27] < blindcoder> fake: but that means I need a 100MBit-NIC
[12:29] < blindcoder> hmm *thinking*
[12:29] < blindcoder> Stupid Idea...
[12:30] < blindcoder> I take a soldering iron and solder an additional wire to each of the 8 wires in the ethernet-cable and attach them to an additional plug
[12:30] < blindcoder> thus creating a passive hub
[12:30] [anders] has indeed shafted the box...
[12:31] < blindcoder> [anders]: how bad?
[12:31] < [anders]> can no longer compile things ...
[12:31] < blindcoder> urks...
[12:31] < [anders]> might be a re-install job... might be fixable, will find out I guess..
[12:32] < blindcoder> [anders]: what about using UML for these things in the future?
[12:33] < [anders]> Perhaps.. the compiler seems to have gone nuts.. it spawns thousands of children and eats RAM like there is no tomorrow..
[12:34] < blindcoder> hmm... there _IS_ no tomorrow for this installation of the compiler, so I think he's doing quite fine :)
[12:35] blindcoder getting hungry speaking of eating
[12:36] < blindcoder> c ya l8er
[12:36] [anders] running tripwire to find out what uClibc managed to mess up...
[12:37] -!- LoriAW is now known as Lorini
[12:38] < owl> re
[12:57] < [anders]> aaahh... found the problem and fixed it.. the relevant command line became: apt-get install --reinstall gcc libc6 libc6-dev binutils
[12:57] < [anders]> now I have to figure out how make works and how I can make it use the root directory of my choice..
[13:05] < [anders]> woohoo.. I think I cracked it..
[13:06] < [anders]> now it is building the binutils.. and hopefully they will use uClibc.. :)
[13:21] < blindcoder> re
[13:28] < fake> [anders] is a cracker ;)
[13:29] < blindcoder> *LOOO*
[13:29] < blindcoder> https://cgi.cs.indiana.edu/~oracle/digest.cgi?N=238#238-10
[13:30] < blindcoder> } Joe: (Dreamy look in his eye) I could sure use a good woman...
[13:30] < blindcoder> Judge: Right. See the clerk for your court-appointed girlfriend. (Bangs gavel) Next case.
[13:39] < [anders]> snarl... the rock build system defaults to using the host OS libc, (which is glibc), so I have to figure out how to make it use uClibc for anything built after it.. :-/
[13:40] < fake> [anders]: how is is done with dietlibc?
[13:42] -!- atheist [~capchaos@pD9048519.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #rocklinux
[13:42] < [anders]> fake: no idea.. dietlibc isn't part of 1.5...
[13:42] < Lorini> hi cap
[13:42] < [anders]> fake: I'll work it out somehow..
[13:43] < blindcoder> hi cap :)
[13:48] < atheist> moin :)
[13:51] < owl> hi atheist
[13:58] < atheist> na owl :)
[14:02] < fake> [anders]: oh,.. you are doingf 1.5 uClibc??
[14:09] < blindcoder> *AAARRRGGGHHH*
[14:09] < blindcoder> NOOOO!!!!
[14:09] < [anders]> fake: ya.. well, trying anyway.. Might have to do it a slightly diffrent way to what I have thought first..
[14:10] < blindcoder> some collegues from another department just came in and stole THE LAST COFFEE!!!
[14:10] < fake> [anders]: why, oh why, aren't you using 1.7?
[14:10] < fake> blindcoder: smart guys.
[14:10] [anders] now wonder if there is a way to get binutils to install without too much hassle..
[14:11] < blindcoder> fake: yes... from their pov
[14:11] < [anders]> fake: /me not touch 1.7 with very long stick until after 2.0
[14:11] < fake> why?
[14:12] blindcoder taking 1.7, changing version to 2.0 and smuggling it silently onto www.rocklinux.org
[14:12] < [anders]> fake: /me unimpressed so far. see no reason to move from 1.5 (which I halfly understand how it works) as 1.5 will actually build and would be good enough to run a server with
[14:13] < [anders]> I need and want a *stable* base to use on my machines, not something that is experimental and half the time isn't intended to work "as it is work in progress"
[14:13] < [anders]> 1.5 has the right idea, get it working and then release a stable base where only patches for security problems go in..
[14:14] < [anders]> I am fully aware that 1.5 isn't 100% solid right this minute, but it is closer to stable (by some margin) compared to 1.7
[14:15] -!- litost [~user@phynp6.phy-astr.gsu.edu] has joined #rocklinux
[14:15] < [anders]> I also have to take in to account that I have to be able to understand the build system if I am to fix any problems myself, and 1.7 is to complicated and at least from what I can gather, so poorly documented that it is no point even considering hacking it unless you have 'guru status'
[14:16] < [anders]> yeah, granted, flashy features and groundbreaking things. I'd love the package management from it for example, but with the rest? I'll pass thank you..
[14:16] < blindcoder> well... yes... the documentien is.. something between sparse and sucks
[14:22] < [anders]> so you can see why I will not make an effort on 1.7? when the prevalent attitude among the core developers is that unless you memorise man-pages you should not tinker with it, they can have it to themselves for all I care...
[14:22] [anders] would rather go back to SuSE than pick up work on 1.7 when the developers have that attitude to those trying to help..
[14:23] fake auch
[14:29] < [anders]> perhaps my attitude sucks, perhaps I got the wrong end of the stick, perhaps I should not be messing with ROCK at all, but I have messed with it for a good while now, I might not have contributed a great deal, but I have contributed.. More than to any other distribution.. It would pain me to have to turn to another distribution, but if that is what have to be done, so be it..
[14:31] < blindcoder> no one said this
[14:31] -!- tcr [~tobrit@pD9E492C7.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #rocklinux
[14:31] < tcr> moin all
[14:31] < blindcoder> moin tcr
[14:36] < [anders]> blindcoder: no, I know that, but the general feeling on the rock mailinglist is making me contemplate wether I should go back to SuSE...
[14:36] < [anders]> lo tcr
[14:37] < fake> [anders]: i didn't mean to offend you
[14:37] < tcr> hi [anders] :) her mår du?
[14:37] < [anders]> fake: you have not offended me in any way... :)
[14:37] < [anders]> tcr: jag är trött.. :)
[14:37] < [anders]> tcr: hur mår du?
[14:37] < tcr> er, right
[14:37] < fake> [anders]: it is just that you could save yourself a lot of time if you'd do that in 1.7, but you are free to do whatever you like to do, of course.
[14:38] < [anders]> fake: but can you see my pov? why should I bother contributing if I am not taken seriously because I do not want to memorise man-pages?
[14:39] < [anders]> tcr: I'm a little tired (and hence edgy).. :) How's life?
[14:39] < tcr> yeah, i understood you ;)
[14:39] < tcr> well, it's ... WEEKEND! ...
[14:40] tcr flips!
[14:40] < blindcoder> tcr: not yet... 2 hours to go
[14:40] < tcr> at least for me *bg*
[14:40] < blindcoder> *grr*
[14:40] < blindcoder> but life in its entirety seems qiuite good :)
[14:41] < fake> [anders]: i see your point.
[14:41] < [anders]> I have little spare time as is, and when I put time on fixing or adding things in ROCK, it is nice to at least not be abused for making that effort..
[14:41] tcr is listening to Dimmu Borgir - Dødsferd
[14:41] < [anders]> at the moment, I feel that the little effort I can make, is appreciated in the 1.5 camp..
[14:42] < [anders]> from what have transpired on the mailinglist in the last few months, I would not waste one (1) second on 1.7
[14:43] < [anders]> (mainly because I feel that any effort would be wasted and not appreciated one bit..)
[14:44] < tcr> [anders]: you may not feel offended by everything. I did this experience myself some weeks ago.. As long as you keep friendly and maybe apell the other person to keep friendly as well..
[14:44] < tcr> words are said very quickly
[14:44] < tcr> but can hurt like fists, indeed!
[14:46] < [anders]> tcr: agreed, but I have not posted much in the last few months, mainly because I feel it would be a) wasted time and b) not appreciated
[14:46] < [anders]> nothing has been said against me, but the atmosphere is such that I wonder why I am still subscribed.
[14:47] < [anders]> in a way perhaps the mailing list should be split so that there is a generic rock list, one for 1.5 and one for 1.7
[14:47] < [anders]> at least that way, I would not have to read the crud regarding 1.7 unless I explicitly subscribed to the list..
[14:48] < tcr> the branch was done too early maybe
[14:48] < tcr> huebi doesn't seem to keep track in any way, and the 1.7 people doesn't seem to respect this fact as it is
[14:48] < [anders]> at the moment, I do work on a software project.. I see the mistakes being made.. the branch at 1.5.12 should not have been done..
[14:49] < [anders]> efforts should have been pooled and 1.5 should have been made stable before branching..
[14:49] < [anders]> the branch could have been made a few weeks before 1.6 was to be released.
[14:50] < fake> [anders]: in fact, that was done.
[14:50] < tcr> afaik, that was thought of 1.5.^1
[14:50] < tcr> .12
[14:50] < fake> [anders]: 1.5.12 was ment to be stabilized, and 1.7 spawned off.
[14:51] < [anders]> so what happened? 1.5.12 was ages ago..
[14:51] < [anders]> I know that efforts was made to tidy up in the code tree..
[14:51] < fake> 1.5.12 was in dec 2001. 1.7 started after we discussed the issues alltogether on 18C3
[14:51] < fake> and hubei volunteered to maintain the 1.5->1.6 stabilizing
[14:51] < rolla> re
[14:51] < [anders]> re rolla
[14:52] -!- capone [~capone@208.165.55.133] has joined #rocklinux
[14:52] < capone> haea
[14:53] < [anders]> Okay, so when 1.6 was still in the making long after it supposedly was to be available, the 1.7 team rather than help and get it finished, decided to ignore it..?
[14:54] < tcr> things like a communication level between the branches haven't ever been made
[14:54] < fake> [anders]: no. that was decided at 18c3. huebi will stabilize 1.5, the other will move on to 1.7. some people volunteered to help huebi.
[14:54] < tcr> e.g. the job of updating pkg. must be done twice, one time in 1.5 and the second time in 1.7
[14:55] < fake> i don't see al the "problems" others seem to see.
[14:56] < tcr> that 1.6 is delaying for a long time, _is_ a problem, isnt it?
[14:56] < fake> 1.5 was ment to stabilize, which takes huebi a bit longer than originally intended. no big deal, he's not paid by anyone, and may move at his speed.
[14:56] < tcr> right
[14:57] < fake> 1.7 spawned and implements new, shiny, great features not possible in 1.5.
[14:57] < fake> and that's all.
[14:58] < fake> rene is getting on my nerves too, with his consequent "we already have this in 1.7"-mails, but ... well, that's rene.
[14:58] < capone> is 1.6 released already ? how does that goes ?
[14:58] < fake> capone: nope, it is not.
[14:58] < fake> (afaik) ;)
[14:59] < capone> k, thanx fake
[14:59] < fake> capone: but the newest 1.5.xx-builds a pretty stable alreay
[14:59] < fake> *already
[14:59] < capone> what's huebi_ still fixing ?
[14:59] < capone> or adding
[15:00] < blindcoder> mostly ports
[15:00] < fake> capone: backwards compaitibily down to 386.
[15:00] < fake> and ports, yes.
[15:00] < blindcoder> sparc64 needs gnome 2.1 for example
[15:01] < capone> ic
[15:01] < blindcoder> because <=2.0 dn't compile
[15:06] < fake> yuck.
[15:06] < fake> enigmail needs mozilla-source.. blaeh.
[15:09] < blindcoder> hehe
[15:11] < fake> no singed message then ... blaeh.
[15:12] < blindcoder> mutt!
[15:12] < blindcoder> mutt!
[15:12] < blindcoder> mutt!
[15:12] < blindcoder> :)
[15:15] [anders] finished whinging for the time being.. Will probably go and buy SuSE for the laptop anyway....
[15:15] < [anders]> I can install ROCK in parallel once I get it to build..
[15:15] < [anders]> build = work and I am happy with it. :)
[15:30] < owl> someone has seen the "3com 905tx" component in kernel 2.4.19??
[15:30] -!- tcr [~tobrit@pD9E492C7.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit ("Ho chresim eidos uch hoch poll eidos sphos")
[15:30] < blindcoder> owl sure
[15:31] < blindcoder> It's called 3C59x IIRC
[15:31] -!- tcr [~tobrit@pD958D8CB.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #rocklinux
[15:31] < capone> ive just received a mail from knopper.. wanna see me in linuxtag :p. seems they confused me, im not liiving there :p
[15:32] < capone> hi owl , tcr
[15:32] < esden> re hi all
[15:32] < esden> puhh ... back on net ...
[15:32] < esden> blindcoder: when are you driving to IN ?
[15:33] < capone> i esden
[15:33] < esden> hi capone
[15:33] < owl> ah. ok. thx
[15:33] < owl> hi capone
[15:33] -!- atheist_ [~capchaos@pD904859D.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #rocklinux
[15:35] < capone> hi capchaos
[15:35] -!- atheist_ is now known as capchaos
[15:35] < blindcoder> esden: 1753
[15:35] < capchaos> hi capone :)
[15:35] < blindcoder> 19:00 in IN 1915 @bitz
[15:36] < esden> urgh ... too late >_<
[15:36] esden shooting blindcoder's jobgiver >_<
[15:37] < blindcoder> sorry
[15:37] < blindcoder> can you eposit the machine @bitz so I can just pick it up together with Zeros?
[15:38] < esden> hmm .. will be difficult ... but I will try to ... I will call you if I manage to do so
[15:38] < esden> otherwise I will bring it with me ... but where ?
[15:38] < esden> what has fake said
[15:38] < esden> is he joining us ?
[15:39] < blindcoder> I don't think so, I'll asx him on the train
[15:40] < blindcoder> just bring it to me
[15:40] < blindcoder> almost everything is prepared
[15:40] < esden> ok ... I can not promise that I will stay long too
[15:40] -!- Eisofen [~grunz@p50817D0D.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #rocklinux
[15:40] < blindcoder> All I need is one Monitor and a NIC
[15:40] < Eisofen> moin
[15:40] < blindcoder> hi Eisofen
[15:40] < capone> hi Eisofen
[15:40] < esden> argh ... monitor ... are you crazy ?
[15:40] -!- Mike1 [~mike@odin.informatica.co.cr] has joined #rocklinux
[15:40] < Mike1> moin
[15:40] < capone> Mike1
[15:40] < esden> I will NOT bring the monitor !
[15:40] < esden> .
[15:41] < esden> hi Eisofen , Mike1
[15:41] < blindcoder> esden: I will get them from Zero, don't panic :)
[15:41] < Mike1> hi all
[15:41] < litost> moin Mike1!
[15:41] < blindcoder> hi Mike1
[15:41] < Mike1> owly awake?
[15:42] < esden> puhh
[15:42] < esden> sun monitors are heavy ...
[15:42] < esden> ok ... I have to go now
[15:42] < Mike1> esden: who cares? they are cool!
[15:42] < Eisofen> quite heavy.. -> Sony...
[15:42] < Mike1> cu esden
[15:42] < esden> Mike1: yes ok ... but I do not like to transport them ...
[15:43] < blindcoder> esden: yes, I lifted one to a 2.20 meter high plate
[15:43] < Mike1> esden: so get blindcoder to carry them you just watch
[15:43] < blindcoder> MIKE!!
[15:43] < Mike1> lol :)
[15:43] < esden> I refuse to transport them if it is not _REALLY_ nessesary
[15:43] -!- term_emu [~pm@pD9E336DE.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #rocklinux
[15:43] < esden> muahaha
[15:43] < blindcoder> I am young and need to take care of my health!
[15:43] < esden> that is a good idea !
[15:44] < esden> ROFL
[15:44] < blindcoder> esden: don't you DARE
[15:44] < esden> muahaha
[15:44] < Mike1> blindcoder: that will help you imprive ur health and make ur muscles grow
[15:44] < blindcoder> esden: is older and thus he has a lower lifespan in front of him
[15:44] < Mike1> so esden dont hesitate on doing it :)
[15:44] < blindcoder> so he doesn't need to care as much as me
[15:44] < capone> hi term_emu
[15:45] Eisofen lives on 3rd floor.. an got one 21" and 20" SUN..
[15:45] < esden> *headshake* you all are evil ...
[15:45] < Eisofen> and NO elevator...
[15:45] < esden> but that is nothing new I think
[15:45] < Mike1> Eisofen: nice workout?
[15:45] < owl> hi Mike1
[15:45] < esden> lol
[15:45] < esden> Mike1: well said
[15:45] < Mike1> esden: *vbeg*
[15:45] < owl> problems fixed? and in cvs?
[15:45] < Eisofen> hrhr
[15:45] blindcoder has 3 SUN Monitars (20") two HPs (21") and a "normal" 17" monitor on his 2nd Floor
[15:45] < Mike1> hi owlita
[15:46] < Mike1> owl i am going to fo it in a moment
[15:46] < owl> ok
[15:46] < esden> blindcoder: when you want to loose some kilos ... carry them up and down your house ;-)
[15:46] < blindcoder> esden: thanks, did that yesterday
[15:46] < Mike1> bwahaha
[15:46] < esden> lol
[15:46] < esden> ok ... I have to go now
[15:46] < blindcoder> moveed almost all the Sun Monitors across 3 floors
[15:46] < capone> cya esden
[15:46] < esden> blindcoder: cu l8er ...
[15:47] < Mike1> cu esdy
[15:47] < blindcoder> esden: bye
[15:47] < esden> and the others too
[15:47] < esden> some time in the future ;-)
[15:47] < blindcoder> be left back
[15:47] < Eisofen> cu esden
[15:47] -!- atheist [~capchaos@pD9048519.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
[15:47] < owl> bye esden
[15:50] < blindcoder> back
[15:51] < Mike1> re blindcoder
[15:58] < blindcoder> booring day today >_<
[15:58] < owl> blindcoder: urg... we should change... i'm working on 4 pcs now... parallel!
[15:58] blindcoder now alone in the office having hotline duty
[15:59] < blindcoder> our boss calls it "Manager On Duty" MOD for short
[15:59] < blindcoder> Wer dubbed it "Master Of Destruction"
[16:00] < blindcoder> not a single call all day >_<
[16:00] < blindcoder> one TroubleTicket and some visiting collegues stealing my coffee
[16:01] < blindcoder> oh wait! theres a TT *jump*
[16:02] < fake> blindcoder : when do you plan on starting the session tonight?
[16:02] < fake> i might bring my ss5 along
[16:03] < blindcoder> fake: as soon as I have installed the K6
[16:03] -!- Lorini [~Lorini@pD9506BC1.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
[16:03] < capone> who could explain me br~iefly how does ROCK flistwr works ?
[16:03] < blindcoder> so I'll be in IN on 19 go to bitz get esdens machine go to Zero get his machine go KFC eat something then go home
[16:04] < blindcoder> then install the K6 with 1.7 generic and then get started
[16:04] < blindcoder> the nfs-roots and kernel are set up already
[16:05] < blindcoder> the room is ready and while 1.7 installs I will set up the network
[16:05] < blindcoder> all in all I hope to boot the Suns aroun 2130
[16:05] < blindcoder> capone: AFAIK it wrapps around file system calls and generates a list out of them
[16:06] < capone> doesnt it take a long time ? parsing ?
[16:06] < capone> cause during a build many libraries are called, and compilation egenrates a lot of temporary files and objetcs
[16:07] < capone> and.. how are fopen calls controlled by other processes ?
[16:07] < blindcoder> the files during compilation aren't in build&/*/root
[16:08] < capone> well, sure
[16:08] < blindcoder> other processes aren't affected. It's a LD_PRELOAD thing
[16:08] < capone> ic
[16:09] < capone> how do new files are parsed ? using stat.h variables ?
[16:10] [anders] has now ordered SuSE 8.1 Pro box set..
[16:11] < [anders]> lo Mike1
[16:11] < Mike1> OMG
[16:11] < capone> ill have a deeper look, thanx blindcoder
[16:11] < capone> :)
[16:11] < Mike1> [anders]: !!
[16:11] < Eisofen> suSE???
[16:11] < Mike1> God Morgon [anders]
[16:11] < Eisofen> whuzzat?
[16:11] < [anders]> Mike1: I require a stable distribution to go on my new HDD in the laptop..
[16:11] Mike1 can't believe this
[16:11] < [anders]> I can parallel install ROCK at a later date..
[16:12] < capone> sth more..
[16:12] < [anders]> God Eftermiddag Mike1 :)
[16:12] < Eisofen> why pay for a borked linux-distro, if debian is for free?
[16:12] < capone> with this LD_PRELOAD thing. one controls things made by a specific process ? in this cxase ROCK build scripts
[16:12] < capone> ?
[16:12] < [anders]> Eisofen: Debian is alright, but I know SuSE slightly better..
[16:13] < Eisofen> hmpf..
[16:13] < [anders]> Eisofen: and SuSE has got v. good support..
[16:14] < [anders]> Besides, it is temporary. (Well, relatively anyway..)
[16:15] < Eisofen> [anders]: well... I wouldn't use it, but it's up to you.. and I don't like this flamewars about linux-distros....
[16:16] < blindcoder> re... damn proxy
[16:16] < blindcoder> capone: LD_PRELOAD make ld link an additinal library into a program before execution
[16:17] < capone> ok
[16:17] < [anders]> Eisofen: I am not abandoning rock 1.5... but what I need for my laptop is stability and easy management... rock doesn't do that yet..
[16:17] < blindcoder> that way one can override some functions
[16:17] < capone> cool
[16:17] < [anders]> my box at home can be tweaked more..
[16:17] < blindcoder> transconnect works that way, too
[16:17] Mike1 considering other options as well
[16:18] < Eisofen> [anders]: right.. 1.5.19 from iso wont boot here :-(
[16:18] Mike1 doesn't like the way 1.7 is going to ..
[16:20] < capone> blindcoder: but.. da u use flwrapper.so in LD_PRELOAD only during ROCK builds right? what i mean is that one could use LD_PRELOAD only for the processes started by build script.
[16:20] < tcr> in general it works for every build
[16:21] < tcr> but the build script are taking a lotta work over
[16:21] -!- tcr [~tobrit@pD958D8CB.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit ("brb")
[16:22] < blindcoder> capone: AFAIK this is the case
[16:22] < capone> good
[16:22] < blindcoder> LD_PRELOAD is set before the build and unset after
[16:23] < capone> yes, only in the build environment is this variable set
[16:24] < capone> sounds very interesting. having a deeper look right now
[16:25] < capone> are rock 1.5 cvs flist sources the same than 1.7 ? or which are more updated ?
[16:26] < blindcoder> phew... good question... I've never really looke dinto the code
[16:27] < blindcoder> *of the wrapper
[16:27] < capone> what id like to see is the parsing
[16:28] < capone> of cnewer and newer files
[16:28] < [anders]> Eisofen: I just need an update to what I am running now, and SuSE I know will do what I want..
[16:32] < th> 16:17:21 < [anders]> Eisofen: I am not abandoning rock 1.5... but what I need for my laptop is stability and easy management... rock doesn't do that yet..
[16:32] < th> hmm
[16:32] < th> [anders]: i can't agree
[16:33] < capone> hi th
[16:34] < th> hi capone
[16:35] < [anders]> th: I need to be able to update the entire system in one go, without worrying wether it will be broken afterwards..
[16:35] < owl> uff.... i'm dying!
[16:35] < [anders]> th: for most things, rock is easy to use.. but there are a few things that could be better, until they are there, I'll have to use SuSE on my laptop..
[16:37] -!- Here [Here@host213-122-83-63.in-addr.btopenworld.com] has joined #rocklinux
[16:37] -!- Here [Here@host213-122-83-63.in-addr.btopenworld.com] has left #rocklinux ()
[16:37] < [anders]> so once and for all, I am not abandoning rock 1.5.. I will carry on helping huebi as I have time spare, just as I have up until now.
[16:38] < [anders]> I want to see rock 1.6 released and I will use it on my server..
[16:40] < th> you won't be able to update 1.6 in one go without worrying wether it will be broken afterwards either
[16:40] < [anders]> just understand my position, I have not got unlimited time. I now have to make choices I did not think I would have to. But I require something that takes less time tinkering with to get working on my laptop. I need it for work, and I have had to look closely at my priorities for what I require there..
[16:40] < [anders]> th: I know that..
[16:40] < [anders]> th: but I will not put 1.6 on a box to update it now and then either..
[16:41] < th> [anders]: so why not using 1.5.19?
[16:41] < [anders]> the laptop is a special case..
[16:41] < th> ahh
[16:41] < th> ok. so u would put 1.5.19 to your server too?
[16:41] < [anders]> 1.5.19 probably yes.. at the moment it is running Debian 3.0
[16:41] < th> i have rock running productive on my laptop and laptops i install for FhG
[16:43] < [anders]> th: I have currently Rock 1.4.0 on my laptop, installed there over 18 months ago.
[16:44] < [anders]> it is now creaking at the seams and I have to do something. I have a new disk (60GB 5400rpm IBM disk) and I will install onto that.
[16:44] owl goes home
[16:44] < owl> bye
[16:45] < owl> cu later
[16:45] < [anders]> cya owl
[16:45] -!- owl [~mail-spam@213.68.39.1] has quit ("back in some hours")
[16:45] -!- capchaos [~capchaos@pD904859D.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit ("brb")
[16:46] < [anders]> there is no question that the SuSE install will be modified quite a bit as well.. I might even use my server at home to rebuild the packages for a p-III CPU rather than the std pentium compile they have now.. :)
[16:54] < blindcoder> *yawn*
[16:54] < blindcoder> time to leave
[16:54] < blindcoder> see you
[16:54] < [anders]> blindcoder: cya
[16:55] < Mike1> yasumi nasai blindcoder
[17:10] [anders] <- off.. got things to do..
[17:12] < capone> cya [anders]
[17:14] -!- tcr [~tobrit@p50813FD9.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #rocklinux
[17:14] < Mike1> welcome tcr
[17:14] < tcr> re all
[17:14] < capone> re thalerim
[17:15] < capone> umm.
[17:15] < capone> in Build-Pkg..
[17:16] Mike1 see's capone asking a lot but nor building ...
[17:17] < capone> when ROCK_FL_WRAPPER is set to 0.. rock uses a simple find command line which makes difference between new and modified files , runnig the main directories in the $ROOT target.. but..
[17:17] < capone> it ignores empty directories
[17:17] < capone> too
[17:17] < capone> i think, it doesnt have to do that
[17:19] < Mike1> capone: send a patch with a proposal on how you think it should be
[17:19] < tcr> no patch, just ask
[17:19] < Mike1> tcr: i would like to see some code for a better way to do it
[17:20] < tcr> of course. Regardines lines should be quoted...
[17:20] < tcr> *garding
[17:21] fake -> train
[17:21] < fake> l8ers
[17:21] < tcr> cu
[17:21] < Mike1> tcr: like Ritchey once said... "Don't talk, just show me the code"
[17:21] < Mike1> *gg*
[17:21] < Mike1> cu fake
[17:21] < tcr> _of course_ but not in form of a patch
[17:22] < Mike1> tcr: i would apply the patch and know exactly what to look at
[17:22] < tcr> uh
[17:22] < Mike1> why would i wanna get all the Build-Pkg script by mail?
[17:22] < tcr> huh?!
[17:23] < Mike1> tcr: i am talking about capone's issue
[17:23] < tcr> you should print lines concerning to the question
[17:23] < tcr> s,print,quote,
[17:23] < Mike1> <capone> when ROCK_FL_WRAPPER is set to 0.. rock uses a simple find command line which makes difference between new and modified files , runnig the main directories in the $ROOT target.. but..
[17:23] < Mike1> <capone> it ignores empty directories
[17:23] < Mike1> <capone> too
[17:23] < Mike1> <capone> i think, it doesnt have to do that
[17:23] < Mike1> <Mike1> capone: send a patch with a proposal on how you think it should be
[17:23] < Mike1> tcr: happy?
[17:24] < Mike1> ping capone
[17:24] < tcr> he _thinks_
[17:24] < Mike1> ok so capone how do you _think_ it should be?
[17:24] < Mike1> :)
[17:24] < tcr> it doesn't matter much, but i dont think clifford will be pleased with sending a patch for asking a question
[17:25] < tcr> because it's a _question_
[17:25] < Mike1> so send a mail to the list and ask the question :)
[17:31] tcr has got a terrible cold :/
[17:31] < Mike1> poor tcr
[17:31] Mike1 pokes capone with a stick
[17:31] < Mike1> capone: are you alive?
[17:31] < tcr> poke it into his righteye
[17:31] < tcr> softly ;P
[17:32] < Mike1> tcr: softly and deeply?
[17:32] < Mike1> *ggg*
[17:33] < tcr> good point
[17:33] < Mike1> hehe its fun, tcr now you try it
[17:34] < capone> re
[17:34] < Mike1> *gg*
[17:35] < tcr> no, in my current constitution i can't do it.. if i sneeze, the snick may slip!
[17:35] < tcr> stick
[17:35] < capone> hey
[17:35] < capone> sorry
[17:35] < capone> this lab crashed :p
[17:35] < capone> re
[17:35] < capone> well
[17:35] < tcr> don't do such bad things
[17:36] < capone> well
[17:36] < capone> some packages create empty directories
[17:36] < capone> like xmms creates empty dir for themes
[17:36] < capone> and some other packages also does
[17:36] < capone> i mean just removing an extra option in flist
[17:37] < capone> flist/'find cmd'
[17:37] < tcr> are you talking 'bout 1.5 or 1.7?
[17:37] < capone> 1.5
[17:37] < capone> is there diff between them ?
[17:38] < tcr> what file:line?
[17:39] < capone> mom
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[17:43] < capone> lemme make some tests
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[18:00] < capone> blindcod1r
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[18:34] < capone> umm,nope
[18:34] < capone> i was wrong
[18:34] < capone> sorry
[18:34] < capone> :)
[18:37] < Mike1> !
[18:38] -!- tcr [~tobrit@p50813FD9.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit ("Ho chresim eidos uch hoch poll eidos sphos")
[18:39] capone waiting for tcr ...
[18:40] -!- tcr [~tobrit@pD958DD73.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #rocklinux
[18:42] < capone> re tcr
[18:45] < capone> cya latah
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[18:49] < qubit> ha!
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[20:17] < tcr> re all
[20:30] -!- Freak [freak@pD9E39C45.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #rocklinux
[20:42] -!- blindcod1r is now known as blindcoder
[20:42] < blindcoder> hi hi and rehi
[20:50] -!- owl [~mail-spam@B5a7e.pppool.de] has joined #rocklinux
[20:50] < owl> re
[20:50] < tcr> re blindcoder, owl
[20:50] < owl> hi tcr, blindcoder
[20:51] < owl> Mike1: did you already update the CVS?
[20:52] -!- cap^one is now known as capone
[20:52] < capone> re
[20:52] < blindcoder> SWEET! NETHACK IS IN ROCK 1.7!
[20:52] < owl> blindcoder: *g*
[20:52] < owl> re capone
[20:52] < blindcoder> hi owl
[20:53] < capone> https://www.worldofescher.com/store/posters5.html
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[21:08] < rolla> jj
[21:09] < fake> re
[21:11] < rolla> Fake
[21:11] < capone> wb fake , tcr , rolla
[21:12] < owl> re fake
[21:14] < fake> WAAAAH
[21:14] < fake> WHAT THE HELL
[21:14] < capone> umm.
[21:14] < fake> argh...
[21:14] < capone> why is 00-dirtree package useful in ROCK ?
[21:14] < fake> w3m is compiled with image-support in current 1.7 per default :(
[21:14] < capone> why make a package of 00-dirtree ?
[21:14] < fake> capone: to assure /usr is not created by a package you might not install
[21:15] < fake> for example
[21:15] < capone> uh ?
[21:15] fake just was shocked... images showing up in my w3m-xterm... *shivers*
[21:15] -!- zer0_o [~zer0_o@194.230.119.26] has joined #rocklinux
[21:15] < capone> it doesnt make sense for me yet..
[21:16] < fake> capone: in a pkg build the created files are noted, and they are what the pkg consists of.
[21:16] < capone> :-/
[21:16] -!- hackbard [~hackbard@p50807F91.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #rocklinux
[21:16] < fake> so if packet xyz is compiled first, and it, for example creates /usr/share
[21:16] < capone> yes
[21:16] < fake> then /usr/share will only be on your system if you have that package installed
[21:16] < capone> right
[21:17] < capone> but this is during build, right ?
[21:17] < fake> usually you want /usr/share anyways, wether there's something in there or not
[21:17] < capone> ah ok
[21:17] < capone> now i got u
[21:17] < fake> even if you don't install that package
[21:17] < fake> so there... hehe ;)
[21:17] < capone> < fake> even if you don't install that package :)
[21:18] < capone> thanx fake
[21:20] -!- tcr [~tobrit@p50813C31.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit ("Ho chresim eidos uch hoch poll eidos sphos")
[21:20] < capone> sure
[21:20] < capone> /proc /tmp /dev wont be created by other packages
[21:20] capone dump
[21:28] < blindcoder> fake: ping
[21:31] < fake> pong
[21:32] < blindcoder> when will you be here?
[21:33] < fake> blindcoder: i'm scanning my worksheets from bs quickly
[21:33] < fake> i just found out that there is a driver for it *jumparound*
[21:34] < blindcoder> sweet
[21:34] < blindcoder> esden is already here
[21:34] < blindcoder> if you can, bring a SUN Monitor with you :)
[21:36] < fake> no way
[21:36] < blindcoder> damn...
[21:36] < fake> i'm not gonna pull this thing anywhere
[21:37] < blindcoder> I'm short one monitor
[21:37] < blindcoder> okay, we'll plug around then :)
[21:37] < fake> you don't need a monitor on any box... ever heard the magic word 'rlogin' ?
[21:39] < blindcoder> I have 4 Monitors now, I want themw to show some things if for nothing else than fun
[21:39] owl --> bed
[21:39] < owl> have fun. gn8. cu
[21:39] < blindcoder> n8
[21:39] -!- owl [~mail-spam@B5a7e.pppool.de] has quit ("zzZZZZz")
[21:50] < fake> narf.
[21:50] < fake> i have to screw the scanner open and clean the glass
[21:50] < blindcoder> why?
[22:09] < fake> because it is dirty and gives me pixel-swarms
[22:17] < blindcoder> hmmm okay
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[22:50] < fake> aaaw!
[22:50] < fake> finished.
[22:50] < fake> blindcoder: ping
[22:53] -!- rxr [~rene@port-212-202-220-84.reverse.qdsl-home.de] has joined #rocklinux
[22:53] < blindcoder> pong
[22:53] < capone> hi rxr
[22:54] < blindcoder> fake: how's it going?
[22:57] < fake> blindcoder: finished.
[22:57] < fake> blindcoder: am i still welcome?
[22:57] < blindcoder> sure!
[22:57] < blindcoder> call me on the phone when you're in front of my house
[22:58] < fake> then i'll now pack up navi and the 100NIC and drive over, see you in 15 min.
[22:58] < esden> re hi all
[22:58] < fake> hi esden & cu soon ;)
[22:58] < blindcoder> okay, see ya
[22:59] < esden> hopefully fake ... I only want you to be helthy ;-)
[23:15] < capone> hi esden
[23:17] < Mike1> esden: still here?
[23:18] -!- capone is now known as d3mian
[23:28] -!- ringo [~ringo@co116627-a.almel1.ov.home.nl] has quit ("changing servers")
[23:29] < esden> Mike1: yes ...
[23:32] -!- rolla [~Der@134.244.181.87] has quit ("leaving")
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[23:34] < d3mian> Dipl.-Ing. Klaus Knopper Dansenberger Straße 44
[23:34] < d3mian> Phone+Fax: +49 631 51504 67661 Kaiserslautern
[23:35] < d3mian> https://www.knopper.net/ GERMANY
[23:35] < d3mian> ----------------------------------------------------------------------------
[23:35] < d3mian> LinuxTag 2003 - Europes largest Linux Expo Where .com meets .org
[23:35] < d3mian> Phone +49 180 5 LINUXTAG Fax +49 180 5 LINUXFAX
[23:35] < d3mian> https://www.linuxtag.org/ Technical Solutions
[23:35] < d3mian> dman mouse
[23:35] < d3mian> ouch !!
[23:35] < d3mian> sorry :p
[23:35] < Mike1> d3mian: !! wtf!1
[23:35] < Mike1> arrg
[23:38] < litost> ok, i'm going home. have a great weekend everyone!
[23:39] < d3mian> same for u litost
[23:39] < Mike1> cu litost
[23:39] -!- litost [~user@phynp6.phy-astr.gsu.edu] has quit ("beertime!!! =)")
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-!- Irrsi Log closed Sat Nov 16 00:00:58 2002